I haven’t had the Covid vaccine and I don’t know what to do now?

The confusion here is about causation. If someone has a heart attack the day after a vaccination, anti-vaxxers leap on this as proof that the vaccine is dangerous, when all it actually tells us is that someone had a heart attack.

Some medical official in Florida stood up and made unsubstantiated claims about the vaccine. He's done it before. His claims were taken apart by many people including Deepti Gurdasani, who i have previously accused on here of scaremongering and over reacting. If she thinks he's overreacting, he's pretty sure to be overreacting. ?

And how many fit young men in Florida died of CoVid?
How many fit young men die of heart attacks in Florida in normal times?
Conversely, how many had the vacine and stayed fit and healthy - no heart attacks and no really bad CoVid?

All these questions have to be answered before the vaccine is proved to be the cause. The studies must go on, but don't assume the result because a study is being done - it is mandatory to study the side effects of all drugs.

Biscuitmuncher

M0nica so a load of fit young men having heart attacks sits well with you? Okay

How many is a load?

Biscuitmuncher

M0nica so a load of fit young men having heart attacks sits well with you? Okay

Oops cross post.

That's not true either. ?

M0nica so a load of fit young men having heart attacks sits well with you? Okay

It hasn't been banned for young men in Florida.

This was talked about at length on another thread.

Boscuitmuncher It's been banned for young men in florida that tells you all you need to know

Well, yes it does, but not quite what you think. It just tells me a lot about the reasoning powers of the person, who thinks a fact like that is the clincher in an argument.

I have been juggling decisions this time, having been very well all through the pandemic and I did have the vaccines as it was my public duty. Small side effects which were good as it proved to me that my body was absorbing the vaccines.

My medic dd is having hers next week, and mine is tomorrow, however she and I chose to have the flu vaccine separately. My flu vaccine is well absorbed by now. I have the paracetamol handy and also the bedsocks as overnight shivering was problematic

Having had flu once as a 26 year old, it is completely flooring and would be hugely difficult now, being elderly. I had my first flu vaccine ever last year. The alternative to being protected is very much worse. The nhs is struggling badly right now, I would not want to be dependent on nhs this winter so I will do everything to help myself as much as possible

Many people do still get Covid even though they have had the vaccination and many of those do still end up in hospital. What the medicos in my family tell me is that there seems to be more deaths amongst those few here who are unvaccinated ( very few in Australia because you had to give up your employment in many cases through 'non-compliance' and they kind of bullied everyone and scared us all into having it). They are people who work in major city hospitals. I caught it a few months after my third vaccination and so did my husband who was extremely ill. What they told us, however, was that it was a different strain. Who knows? There is still a lot of research needed but in the meantime, I would think it is safer to be vaccinated than unvaccinated.

A lot of people seem to be saying take GP advice. I visited my GP for the first time since a broken ankle 4 years ago as I was concerned that I had polymyalgia rheumatica. I had a painful neck and shoulders after my third booster vaccination several months later (and still have). Blood tests eliminated this but my GP suggested I should not need the covid booster as I was otherwise healthy. He did say I should have the flu vaccination however. The pressure to have the covid booster is massive so even weighing up all the evidence either way I too am now unsure. I agree with ElaineI that we still have a lot to learn about this disease.

I've had all the covid vaccines and due the autumn one on Saturday with the flu one. Last year the flu one caused much more discomfort than usual and more than the covid ones but I've always had it due to nursing as we are recommended to get it. I've had covid once - was ill for 3 days like flu then ok though I still feel a bit out of breath and that was in June. Have seen the pictures of a normal and covid placenta which are really shocking. There is still a lot about this virus that we don't know. Regarding the vaccine, DS hasn't had one and also has had covid once similar to me. I don't know really if it's worth it or not. It was so frightening at the start of the pandemic when so many were dying but we still have a lot to learn. DD1 has not had her children 8 and 5 vaccinated and I'm fully supportive of that as there is not enough research about the effects on growing children. They do have the flu one at school.
I remember working in out of hours in 1999 or 2000, can't remember which, and we were inundated with families seriously ill with flu many of whom were hospitalised. The queues were up and down corridors with very unwell people waiting to be seen. Viruses are b-----s and change all the time!

The fact that The fact is that.

The fact that many people get Covid after having had the vaccination - I did, though very mildly - but it's worth noting that the present booster vaccination has been modified to work against the Omicron variant. I'm hoping that this will keep me and mine safe this winter.

Biscuitmuncher

I've never had the vaccine either. People on here would have the jab everyday if some pharmaceutical company told them to. It's been banned for young men in florida that tells you all you need to know

Source for your assertion Bisvuitmuncher ?
Not that you might be biased of course……

I've never had the vaccine either. People on here would have the jab everyday if some pharmaceutical company told them to. It's been banned for young men in florida that tells you all you need to know

Good analysis M0nica.

If there is one phrase that makes my blood boil, it is "they put her in a home". She's a human being Bengalcatowner, not a stray cat. If she exists at all, of course.

Watch safe and effective on YouTube

One of the main reasons for so many of the problems the OP sees are the result of the maths of probability and also coincidence.

For example, something like 94% of the population over 12 has had one vaccine shot. I did some quick rough maths with government figures and reckoned that 64 million of the 67 million people in the country have had at least one jab, and about 45 million have had all three.

^I hear of people, young people, who have heart attacks, stroke, chronic fatigue. Cancers which go from being discovered to end stage within months. Women experiencing months of menstrual problems, women having periods again years after menopause!

Withing my circle of friends I know one lady whose daughter had a still born at 8 months, who was told by midwives they have seen an increase in this happening!

The mother of another friend, her mild dementia got worse rapidly and they had to put her into a home.^ Bengalcatowner.

In a population of 67 million where probably 175 million doses of vaccine have been administered, and around 700,000 die every year and many more get headline illnesses but survive, it is inevitable that some people will have heart attacks, strokes and all these other problems within days of having vaccinations, and for all but a tiny handful, there will be no connection between the vaccination and the illness.

It would be quite normal for one maternity hospital to experience a smallrise in still births, it doesn't follow that every hospital is experiencing the same thing, or that it is anything more than natural variation.

A qualified statistician, could actually work out the probability of any of these events being connected, I cannot do the calculations but I know the answer will be very small indded.

You'd be one of the green people in the smaller circle - not the red ones.

Have another look at my diagram at 09:03:42 today, BengalCatOwner If unvaccinated, you will be in the smaller circle, in far more risk of hospitalisation if you catch the virus than those in the vaccinated circle. Is that playing it safe?

BengalCatOwner

Thank you for all your replies. I really appreciate it.

I’m still at a bit of a loss, but I guess going on a cruise is probably out of the question?

I’m not sure, but the more I read, the more I don’t trust these vaccinations. I think I am going to err on the side of caution x

That made me smile actually.

You’re not erring on the side of caution. You’re choosing the path of risk.

The numbers of reported illness just in this country tell us that you’re much more likely to suffer illness both short and long term from Covid than you are from the vaccine.

So your choice but don’t fool yourself you’re being cautious. You’re just the opposite. ?

I wasn't getting at you, Jaffacake When you know that you are one of those who are pretty certain to have that bad reaction, you are naturally very careful to avoid risking it.

My point is that people who are not specifically vulnerable hear of a rare case and are scared it will happen to them. Seeing the relative chances of getting a bad reaction from the vaccination versus getting one because you didn't have the vaccination should make a sensible choice more likely. Should do, but may not, we are not logical creatures.

BengalCatOwner

Thank you for all your replies. I really appreciate it.

I’m still at a bit of a loss, but I guess going on a cruise is probably out of the question?

I’m not sure, but the more I read, the more I don’t trust these vaccinations. I think I am going to err on the side of caution x

I cannot understand why you might still be at a loss.

The way forward is so obvious. Talk to your doctor about what happened to you after the flu jab and get the proper advice as to the safety of the covid jab for you as an individual. If the advice is that it is OK, then do it; if it isn't, then don't.

Elegran

Vaccination makes so much difference to your chances of getting CoVid badly enough to be hospitalised. If you go by just the number of people in hospital (in the smaller circle) that isn't clear, but the complete righthand diagram shows the proportions of people hospitalised out of those with or without vaccination.
Does anyone have a similar comparison for the proportion of people getting bad complications after the jab, compared to the proportion getting bad complications who haven't" been vaccinated? Not the ^number of those whose dramatic stories are made a lot of noise about, but what percentage out of the totals. I suspect there is a vast difference.

Sorry wasn't trying to make a lot of noise or drama about my reaction . Just putting another perspective on the discussion.
Anaphylaxis after vaccine has been quoted as 1: 1000,000. Rare but does put me in a difficult situation in a pandemic.