Princess Grace hospital cancelled vital surgery for woman who requested single-sex care

Fleurpepper

She would not see it as deceipt, at all. Honestly.
But it would be deceit if your niece presented as a female where being female has been expressly requested/agreed or specified by an area or situation labelled female because your niece has not and cannot change sex.
If your niece chooses to think “I’m a woman”-which since the word was corrupted by males in 2004 then why not.
If your niece doesn’t acknowledge being an AHM that’s her problem.
If your niece when saying ‘woman’ is claiming to be AHF, then that’s a lie.
If your niece chooses to use that thought to claim to be female in the situations I’ve mentioned above then your niece, on those occasions, is being deceitful and dishonest.

I would hope your niece out of respect for all AHF women would not allow being placed in a situation which requires such deceit, but your posts make me wonder about that.

growstuff

Lathyrus

Um

Me: I hope the violation of patient dignity and privacy will be thoroughly investigated

Violetsky: No thanks

Her dignity and privacy weren't violated.

As I said before the days when staff (and other people like cleaners) could just enter a patients private room without permission, are long gone.

It simply isn’t done. To protect privacy and dignity all staff will knock and usually say something like can I come in.

Wards are bit different but even there if the curtains are closed staff will call to the patient before entering.

For someone to simply walk in would be regarded as very poor practice at the very least.

Lathyrus I agree. It's the only thing which needs investigating - and the hospital said almost immediately that it was been. Presumably the hospital had policies in place about entering rooms and they were breached. Apart from that, there has been so much hype about this - it really is an object lesson in how social media can stir.

Quite honestly, there have been so many lies, I'm even wondering if anybody did walk in unannounced.

We don't know if the person who entered the room was male or female.

It is known that a fully transitioned surgeon works at the hospital. The surgeon is very well respected and is now being targeted on social media, despite being known as a woman for 27 years.

Lathyrus

I find myself agreeing with volver there if the patient hadn’t made that request until after.

I nevertheless hope that the violation f patient privacy and dignity is thoroughly investigated and I also hope that the pro-trans people on here will acknowledge that it should be.

The debates gone off in some very disturbing ways, with a poster claiming she knows there is only one lesbian here (how?) another who thinks women are nothing more than - well I have to say it- a fuck and others who see a patient as an inert object that medical staff can revolve around without a thought to mental health or emotional need.

All in the name of trans rights?

Lathyrus

Blatant missuse of a quote, let's put the rest of your comment back in

And no thank you to answering comments asserting what I think or otherwise just being rude

Oops, you’ve missed out your

No thanks

growstuff

It is known that a fully transitioned surgeon works at the hospital. The surgeon is very well respected and is now being targeted on social media, despite being known as a woman for 27 years.

So once again the stupid actions of one TW are causing problems for other trans.

Lathyrus

Oops, you’ve missed out your

No thanks

Are you OK?

VioletSky

Lathyrus

Oops, you’ve missed out your

No thanks

Are you OK?

Ooh, that’s a personal remark.

Lathyrus

growstuff

We don't know the facts of this case

But we do know the facts! The woman and others have published all the emails, which contradict the story as it became embellished on social media.

We know some of the facts.

We still don’t know why the member of staff entered the room.

That’s what the management have to investigate no matter how objectionable the patient is.

That’s the complaint procedure.

This is the bit I am talking about. Until there is an investigation we won't know what happened however much we speculate on here.

I haven't read her emails - do they explain her motivation, or is that speculation too?

I am less interested in the case than the fact that people seem to think that women don't have a right to make informed choices like this. Whether they are the choices any of us posting on this thread would make isn't important. It is the way the TWAW mantra has removed the right to know and make decisions that matters - it really does feel as though women just don't matter any more.

Pressed send by accident before.

At the risk of being called part of a c*** can I point out how long it has been said by many posters, that people don’t think all trans are harmful, but that the poor choices of a certain number of trans, usually TW and their supporters does more harm to trans than any other group and reflects badly on the trans as a whole.

Doodledog Nearly all of it has been manufactured by somebody who is skilled at orchestrating transphobic campaigns. The woman herself was on GBNews and put the record straight.

She didn't request single sex care when she chose the hospital. She changed her mind and then demanded single sex accommodation and threatened legal action. Her operation would have required a stay in ICU, but the hospital doesn't have single-sex facilities, so cancelled the op. At no stage was the operation as critical as some have claimed.

Clique not clic

It's not just speculation on here. The emails have been published and the woman herself was on GBNews.

Mollygo I also think that people like the anti-trans person who has manufactured this controversy do a lot of harm to people with genuine concerns about gender identity.

The actions of one do not reflect badly on any demographic they belong too.

Thinking that is the case is the literal bread and butter of discrimination.

Mollygo

growstuff

It is known that a fully transitioned surgeon works at the hospital. The surgeon is very well respected and is now being targeted on social media, despite being known as a woman for 27 years.

So once again the stupid actions of one TW are causing problems for other trans.

We don't even know that the person who entered the room was trans. The woman originally claimed she looked like a drag queen, but backtracked from that. It was, of course, picked up by the social media posters.

VioletSky

The actions of one do not reflect badly on any demographic they belong too.

Thinking that is the case is the literal bread and butter of discrimination.

Especially as it's not known if the person was "one of them". It was only what the patient imagined and claimed.

Ok. Whatever happened in this particular case, the principle remains - do women have a right to ask for single sex accommodation and/or for only female staff to touch them intimately? Usually there is a chaperone present when a male staff member examines a female patient. If a male staff member says he identifies as female should that still happen?

(question to anyone with an opinion - not aimed at anyone in particular)

Growstuff, I evidently don’t know as much as you do about this case, but as a general rule, how can it be anti trans to ask for female only support when vulnerable, for female safe spaces or for female only sports competitions. That would be discrimination against females and that’s unacceptable.
Yet it’s only a small number of trans and fans who insist on doing this and thus damaging the image of all trans.

Exactly what I have been saying. How would she have known???

Drag Queens are not trans! And some transgender people do not look it at all. And some real women do look a bit 'different' for umpteen reasons. It is all nonsense.

I'd say let's leave it for now- and await the results of the investigations and the FACTS.

Back to page 2?

Sure

I may be wrong but I don't think trans people are opposed to the phrase "assigned male/female at birth"

So politely asking to see a doctor or nurse that way might be the way forward

Or other phrasing that doesn't involve refusing pronouns, being rude and demanding or otherwise being prejudice to trans people only