Trainee GP concerns?

HelterSkelter1

Ronib. The ""hun" comment and the "short skirt" comment were both attributed to one poster when in fact they were made by 2 separate posters. It all gets so fractious. I understand the thread. It's not difficult, but as I said it gets boring. I'm off for a bath so no need to reply.

"The Hun" and "short skirt" comments were both made by Primrose.

I have only formally complained once at my GP surgery.

My meds were stopped, due to a lack of communication from the surgery, when a GP failed to review my controlled drugs and I couldn't understand why the prescription hadn't been written.
I had just come out of hospital after a heart attack and was left with withdrawal symptoms, because the repeat hadn't been prescribed.
I received a formal apology from the Practice Manager.

I certainly wouldn't waste my time and their time, because someone called me 'hun' (I did a touble take, when I read your post. In Glasgow that has a totally derogatory meaning, b.t.w. 😉)

The fact you got the referral you needed after one visit, is a positive outcome. I have been waiting for a referral since Decemeber 2023, when my Cardiologist wrote to my GP, saying I needed one see consultant in a different speciality, the referral still hasn't been done.
You are very fortunate in that the trainee did her job, regardless of her appearance.

Marydoll there definitely is a problem with leaving hospital with the right medication and the gp having full information immediately available.
My friend’s gp continued to prescribe the wrong medication that is pre hospital medication and had not received emails on discharge. It was a real battle to get this sorted out. It should not be happening but it is.

ronib

Marydoll there definitely is a problem with leaving hospital with the right medication and the gp having full information immediately available.
My friend’s gp continued to prescribe the wrong medication that is pre hospital medication and had not received emails on discharge. It was a real battle to get this sorted out. It should not be happening but it is.

It wasn't the hospital's fault. I had been on this controlled drug for years, there was a lack of communication between the surgery pharmacist and my G.P.

I was too unwell to deal with it, was forced to do so.

Marydoll

I have only formally complained once at my GP surgery.

My meds were stopped, due to a lack of communication from the surgery, when a GP failed to review my controlled drugs and I couldn't understand why the prescription hadn't been written.
I had just come out of hospital after a heart attack and was left with withdrawal symptoms, because the repeat hadn't been prescribed.
I received a formal apology from the Practice Manager.

I certainly wouldn't waste my time and their time, because someone called me 'hun' (I did a touble take, when I read your post. In Glasgow that has a totally derogatory meaning, b.t.w. 😉)

The fact you got the referral you needed after one visit, is a positive outcome. I have been waiting for a referral since Decemeber 2023, when my Cardiologist wrote to my GP, saying I needed one see consultant in a different speciality, the referral still hasn't been done.
You are very fortunate in that the trainee did her job, regardless of her appearance.

A blind man on a galloping horse could work out I needed a referral.

HelterSkelter1

Ronib. The ""hun" comment and the "short skirt" comment were both attributed to one poster when in fact they were made by 2 separate posters. It all gets so fractious. I understand the thread. It's not difficult, but as I said it gets boring. I'm off for a bath so no need to reply.

Sorry if it seems abrasive. I’d just rather address attitudes I find unpalatable in a thread rather than ‘reporting’, and I just could not let that one pass me by.
Hope you enjoyed your bath. 😀

On the topic of the thread, I have found trainee gps to be thorough and health professionals at the surgery to be cheerful, caring people who have more time than the gps. I’d prefer to see someone who can deal with my (usually) minor issues rather than clog up the gp’s schedule. I do realise that I am very fortunate, and am grateful for my health.

A blind man on a galloping horse could work out I needed a referral..

Working out that you need a referral is one thing, actually getting one is a totally different matter.

My urgent referral now requires a a chest x-ray, before the it can be actioned.
I had it five weeks ago, but apparently they are taking ten weeks to come back.
I will probably be dead by the time, I eventually see someone.

Not everyone gets a quick referral, despite the urgency.

I agree, their training is more recent and we've found that locums were sometimes more up to date though all GP's are supposed to take regular updating courses. In our experience most trainees are not worried about seeking a second opinion if required. It was actually a locum who picked up my husband's serious heart failure after two previous appointments with our GP practice.
As regards the flow charts, I do think that many GPs follow a menu like this, they're tried, tested and compiled by experts so it's probably a good way to work out what is wrong in most cases. After all, GP's are not specialists like those in particular hospital departments.

A blind man on a galloping horse could work out I needed a referral

Is this then the answer to our NHS staffing shortages?

Bring back Lester Pigott.

I have found trainee gps to be thorough and health professionals at the surgery to be cheerful, caring people who have more time than the gps.

But in the end do they know their stuff? Will they be capable of making the right diagnosis and organising the right treatment? These are more important than being cheerful, although both would be nice!

I guess the term trainee GP needs defining - one hopes this refers to fully medically qualified people and not PAs.

At the practice I used to work at, all trainee gps/GP regisrars had a debrief session on all the patients they saw that day with a senior GP.

I wish I could actually get to see a GP. In the 5 years that our GP surgery moved, taking in a wider catchment area, I have managed to see a GP once. It's always been with a Clinician, Advanced Practioner, or a Paramedic Practioner. I tried to make an appointment the other day and asked why I couldn't see a GP, their answer 'The GP's only see people who are ill or in an emergency'.! BTW, the earliest appointment is 25th September !

Judy54

I am more concerned about the Physician Associates who have 2 years training and are not qualified Doctors. Their role is to assist Doctors not take their place. It is very concerning that they are being allowed to do things that only trained Doctors should be doing. They are soon to be recognised by the General Medical Council Why? The problem is we are not told when visiting our GP's whether we are seeing an actual Doctor or a Physician Associate. This cannot and should not be acceptable to Patients.

This is my experience entirely and I completely agree with you. I have no confidence at all in our local GP surgery but it seems that this is common feeling about other practices in my area. What can you do?

I work in a GP practice which is a teaching practice, the trainees we have are already fully qualified doctors and every consultation is reviewed by one of the GP partners. If they have any concerns about the advice given to a patient then the patient would be recontacted. You are within your rights to request a follow-up appointment with another GP.
It isn't unusual for any doctor to use charts or even online tools to assist with diagnosis and treatment.

Luckygirl3

*I have found trainee gps to be thorough and health professionals at the surgery to be cheerful, caring people who have more time than the gps.*

But in the end do they know their stuff? Will they be capable of making the right diagnosis and organising the right treatment? These are more important than being cheerful, although both would be nice!

I guess the term trainee GP needs defining - one hopes this refers to fully medically qualified people and not PAs.

Yes, I do feel that they know their stuff because they deal with specific areas and are trained in those. The phlebotomist takes blood samples, the junior nurse changes dressings and does heights, weights and bps etc.
Gps are generalists with a wide range of knowledge to draw on and experience to back it up. They are an invaluable resource in a practice but do not need to be involved in collecting the evidence towards making a diagnosis or in providing ongoing low-level care.

A trainee GP is a qualified doctor who is doing two years extra training to become a GP. They are supervised by an experienced GP. As mentioned upthread they report back to their mentor and may well discuss each case at the end of the day. If at all unsure they can call on a GP in the practice.
I would just mention that the mentoring takes place outside of surgery hours so doesn’t impact on appointment times.

My surgery always seems to have trainee GP's, very difficult to see an experienced GP. One such trainee rang me back after a phone consult. and sending photos of complaint and.told me I probably had oral cancer and he was referring me to an oncologist straight away. Later that day he rang again, after talking to a trained GP and told me everything was OK. Another trainee who hardly spoke English obviously did not understand what I was saying and I could not understand him despite my asking him to speak slowly 'because it was a bad line' . He eventually sent me some info online the first para of which said if the complaint lasted more than 2 weeks speak to a GP urgently. I had said several times to him that the problem had been going on for a couple of months by then and I'd had a couple of meds which had made no difference.
I think these trainees should be supervised at all times.

I guess the term trainee GP needs defining - one hopes this refers to fully medically qualified people and not PAs
It should be perfectly clear which is which.
It seems only on Gransnet that people don’t know the difference..

The last time I booked to be seen by what I thought was a GP, I was seen by a Paramedic Practitioner. These seem to crop up in many surgeries as government funding makes them much cheaper to employ than GPs.
The training for a PP is not nearly as long or as demanding as GP training.
It may be that, in some cases you were seen by a PP and not a GP.

M0nica

Trainee GP nearly killed our daughter.

And a newly qualified nurse practicioner diagnosed my FIL with a virus, quite rudely, but he had three stents fitted a few days after when he collapsed at home.

Hopefully the main GP trainer will review the notes but it wouldn’t hurt to check what time the doctors take phone calls and say you are concerned or e-mail if that’s how your surgery now communicates. Ours wants e-mails instead of face to face appointments apparently, though I avoid them like the plague. Confidentiality no longer exists.

Hope you manage to get someone to listen!

" Trainee GPS" are now more commonly known ad GP registrars for this very reason.
You assumed this is a doctor who has not yet qualified.
In fact they will be a fully qualified doctor, having studied for 5 years to get their degree.
They then train for a further 2 years in a number of different specialities and join the GP training scheme.
They are observed by their GP trainer at the practice and will discuss cases and get feedback.
They are highly qualified and usually extremely knowledgeable and up to date. They are usually cautious to a fault and take great care .
I am totally convinced you got the best possible advice and, yes , all us doctors use the Internet, flow charts etc etc etc.
Why wouldn't we take advantage of all that modern technology offers to do our best for our patients?

GP trainees are not doctors in training. They are fully qualified doctors who have also done 2 years as hospital doctors before their specialism to GP work. They have to be fully supervised and pass many additional exams. One bad experience should not tarnish all these doctors.

I guess the term trainee GP needs defining - one hopes this refers to fully medically qualified people and not PAs.

My dd is a trainee GP. She began her medical training ten years ago next month. She did a six year degree, graduated from med school in the Spring of 2020 and was launched straight into the Covid pandemic, where sometimes she and one other junior doctor were responsible for up to 225 patients overnight.

Since then she has worked for two years in one of the busiest A&E’s in the country, seeing all manner of ills (and not so ills) in patients from tiny babies to very elderly folks. Her current placement is in palliative care and she will have another four placements before she qualifies as a GP, by which time she will be 31 years old. When working at GP surgeries in a training position she has even had patients asking to be seen by her so I suggest that’s a vote of confidence in her skills.

Any surgery claiming that a PA is a trainee GP is misrepresenting their staff and should be taken to task.

Mirren

" Trainee GPS" are now more commonly known ad GP registrars for this very reason.
You assumed this is a doctor who has not yet qualified.
In fact they will be a fully qualified doctor, having studied for 5 years to get their degree.
They then train for a further 2 years in a number of different specialities and join the GP training scheme.
They are observed by their GP trainer at the practice and will discuss cases and get feedback.
They are highly qualified and usually extremely knowledgeable and up to date. They are usually cautious to a fault and take great care .
I am totally convinced you got the best possible advice and, yes , all us doctors use the Internet, flow charts etc etc etc.
Why wouldn't we take advantage of all that modern technology offers to do our best for our patients?

Well said.
How many more times though does it need repeating that GP registrars are NOT YOP Trainees, nor yet the practice GP partners’ offspring on a Bring Your Children To Work Day!

Trainee GP's are qualified doctors, but are doing General Practice training.

Of much more concern are the Physician Associates and Anaesthetic Associates that the last government deliberately deskilled our NHS with, and the current government is doing little to address!

This unfolding #PAScandal has absolutely nothing to do with improving healthcare access or outcomes.
& everything to do with increasing PROFIT & making it easier to privatise the NHS bit by bit.

These PA/AA's do a 2 year allegedly 'no fail' course and are being used in hospitals to replace qualified doctors (Junior Doctors ARE QUALIFIED, these aren't)

Our qualified doctors are raising red flags for patient safety, but the press are saying that there is a lot of support for them to reduce the waiting lists.

RosiesMaw2

Mirren

" Trainee GPS" are now more commonly known ad GP registrars for this very reason.
You assumed this is a doctor who has not yet qualified.
In fact they will be a fully qualified doctor, having studied for 5 years to get their degree.
They then train for a further 2 years in a number of different specialities and join the GP training scheme.
They are observed by their GP trainer at the practice and will discuss cases and get feedback.
They are highly qualified and usually extremely knowledgeable and up to date. They are usually cautious to a fault and take great care .
I am totally convinced you got the best possible advice and, yes , all us doctors use the Internet, flow charts etc etc etc.
Why wouldn't we take advantage of all that modern technology offers to do our best for our patients?

Well said.
How many more times though does it need repeating that GP registrars are NOT YOP Trainees, nor yet the practice GP partners’ offspring on a Bring Your Children To Work Day!

Thank you, Mirren from someone, who is qualified to clarify this.