House of Commons discussion on bladder and bowel control in adults and children

At the risk of being facetious, many of us are “bricking it” at what Trump is likely to do next.

Well I hope throwing a light on these health conditions will also lead to some serious scrutiny of the woeful lack of public conveniences, supervised and maintained to acceptable hygiene standards.

Thank you Silverbrooks certainly a better side of British politics, I hope it leads to positive change.

That was one of the many issues discussed in particular with regard to the lack of waste disposal bins in male toilets for men who need to wear pads, and better facilities for people who have a stoma and need to empty and replace a colostomy bag.

Part of the discussion was about shops and businesses making their toilets available for people who suffer from urgency. I have Crohn's and carry an Urgent Can't Wait card from Crohn's and Colitis UK. I have never been refused but not all staff are aware that some disabilities are invisible. The hestitate, say they have to ask permission of somebody else ... which is problematic when one can't wait!

This is such a serious and inportant subject, yet in Britain for some strange reason any mention of anything to do with bowels seems to be cause for merriment. It is not funny to the very many people (of all ages) who suffer from problems.
I had Ulcerative Colitis for ten years, my 'going out' anytime, anywhere, was subject to toilet facilities en-route and where I was going.

I had (have) one of those cards mentioned, never had the guts to use it. For the past 35 years I have had an Ileostomy, do use accessible (disabled) loos as it there is any problem need to have a wash hand basin available.

One of my g.children, had a problem in that the nerve endings in her bowel did not work, so she never knew when she needed to pass a motion. Her Mum often got sworn at when she emerged from an Accessible Loo with - what appeared to be a very healthy and normal child. But of course, she often needed total cleaning up and change of clothes.

Fortunately, she grew out of this in puberty - the hospital she was under had said this often happened with this condition (but not always).

The lack of public toilets, and the locking of many of those that do exist early in evenings, etc. is a disgrace and causes people with any sort of problems refusing to leave their own homes, which leads to mental health problems etc.

Exactly, Franbern.

You might find Judy Gosling’s (Labour Nuneaton) contribution to the discussion interestimg. She chairs the APPG (All-Party Parliamentary Group for bladder and bowel continence care and talked particularly about children’s needs.

In her speech she said:

The importance of talking about wee and poo cannot be overstated. As any three-year-old will tell you, that is because it is funny. Wee and poo is the funniest topic in nursery classrooms up and down the country—and it is funny, right up until the point that it is not. When wee and poo stop being funny, it is devastating.

Is part of the “funny” problem though, that we use trite babyish names like “wee” and “poo”? Perhaps if people would say “urine” and “faeces” in everyday use, we would not be so giggly about problems?

Well up here in Scotland they should come and look as the lack of public toilets is shocking! Edinburgh, the capital is absolutely abysmal. Most cities are. As for businesses letting you use their facilities, forget it. The place is awash with ' toilets for customers only' notices. At just about £4 for a coffee, it's a very expensive toilet. The Covid excuse wears thin. Park and Ride facilities see the toilets closed and men including bus drivers having to go around the back of the building to do their business. What women do, heaven knows. No wonder we all get constant UTIs. A disgrace and an embarrassment. Sorry, rant over.

Thank you for this thread Silverbrooks as I have problems too suddenly needing to go.

All shops should have a WC available, on request. Very small shops well it has to be u to the owner on request to make sensible decisions. If people find out there is a WC they can say, sorry, its just for the elderly and people carrying a badge"

(must get a badge, Silverbrooks, will work out a way - is it the sunflower badge/wear round neck for hidden disabilities?)

I have just answered my own question. You can buy them on Amazon, a Badge and Lanyard, for about £9, just google

"how can I get a sunflower badge and lanyard" for full range of stockists.

I could get a covering letter from my GP, I reckon, have been on at them for last few days trying to get max help for my condition, so they know me.)

Why would Amazon sell these, surely that means anyone can buy one, and where woukd we be in the queue for the loo then?
( yes I need to get one too, colitis isn’t funny).

When I am at work in a busy large retail store I get asked at least once per shift if we have toilets for the public. We don’t.

It is a legitimate security issue and takes a staff member from the shop floor to escort them (occasional exceptions are made for eg heavily pregnant women and those with a “need to go” card.
It is one of the important issues of our times but no one but those who are in need seems to care. It has no simple workable solution either.

My Urgent Can't Wait card comes with my membership to Crohn’s and Colitis UK but you can get a free digital card for your phone from:

www.bladderandbowel.org/free-just-cant-wait-card/#:~:text=Download%20%3E%20Urgent%20toilet%20access%20for%20people,Card%20%3E%204.6%20Based%20on%2011%2C532%20reviews.

Or £3.95 for a plastic card to cover costs.

I've also got a radar key for unlocking accessible toilets. I bought that for a few pounds.

“Very small shops it has to be up to the owner on request”.

The Insurance for shop owners only covers the areas used by the public as far as liability for public health and safety are concerned.

Any owner opening their staff toilet to a member of the public would make themselves personally liable for any accident or health issues , that the user might chose to bring against them - including things like distress because of inadequate of toilet paper. Not to mention slipping on wet floors, knocking against shelves etc

Even though the owners kindly “allowed” the use of their toilet, the liability still stands.

This might explain why sufferers feel shop owners are not always very understanding or co-operative.

Of course, there is the issue with anti-social behaviour in public toilets. That will be one of excuses made about giving open access to people in genuine need.

Markus Campbell Savours (Labour Penrith and Solway) described …

^2021 building regulations requiring all new public buildings to put in large and well-equipped toilet facilities. Many local authorities have ensured provision in creative and economical ways, through community toilet schemes and payments or rates reductions for businesses that open their toilet facilities to the public. Local authorities can make planning permission, leases and premises licences subject to the provision of public toilets …

Currently TV ads are awash with women leaking urine into their pee pants, adults and children too embarrassed to have a poo at work or school. Fart or shit in the bathroom at home? That's so disgusting it needs chemical deodorant, and in the latest ads, so does every part of your freshly washed body .

These ads are not teaching body confidence and carefree freedom. They do exactly the opposite.

silverlining48

Why would Amazon sell these, surely that means anyone can buy one, and where woukd we be in the queue for the loo then?
( yes I need to get one too, colitis isn’t funny).

Pass. But thats why I will get a GP letter back up or another source that treats my condition, and thats the way shops can cross check? There are a few shops I use, and it's a matter of using staff toilets. But thats why I do like my small but convenient Retail park - there is a Costa, and toilets in TK Max/Home base place so can do lots of shopping (not that I need an excuse for M n S foodie store, tho it be toilet free, its next door to TK. better watch out when I downsize next year - reset toilet check - yes there is a small retail park near with Sainsbugs and costa with toilets....

You could go for the Amazon option and get your back up letter too, silverlining?

I'm getting muddled between silverbrook and silverlining phew (both lovely names).

I'll think over the card/app silverbrooks.

I do need to do something about it. I am in the midst of another flare up now.
I once had to beg to use a shop toilet, and as I am older, look harmless and asked politely they agreed somewhat reluctantly. It was embarrassing; luckily made it with no time to spare, TMI I know.

windmill1

Well I hope throwing a light on these health conditions will also lead to some serious scrutiny of the woeful lack of public conveniences, supervised and maintained to acceptable hygiene standards.

Well said.

Very interesting debate however what will change? Probably nothing! As a doubly incontinent woman, having suffered for more than 40 years. Firstly Crohn’s, then bladder incontinence as well. Getting help from the NHS is becoming a joke. Luckily I have a great GP. However, having attended UroGyn appointments, it would be better if there was a joined up approach with a one stop department. Gynae does so much and Urology does other things. My main problem presently is recurrent UTI’s causing much worsened incontinence of the bladder. This has been ongoing for many years however much much worse for over a year now. Also I’m in Scotland and the debate cover NHS England!
It was good that it was raised in the Commons.

I must say I am proud of our local MP for trying to get such an important subject discussed. So many people have had to suffer in silence for too long as help can be limited. I also blame the lack of public toilets for making the problem worse.

Yes, it was great, and really important.

Well done Labour.