Telephone line - that swop away from normal copper lines

I'm related to someone who worked for B.T. for many years.
The old copper cables, originally installed, and maintained, at massive expense all over our country by the G.P.O. - (later called B.T.) are now seriously deteriorating, and having to be replaced.

B.T. was gradually stopped from being a monopoly by our government, between 1984 and 1991. So now they have to share the network with many other phone suppliers.

For them it is no longer an affordable possibility to dig up all the roads or pavements again, all over the country, to install new copper cables!!! In any case, with the internet, it is sadly an outdated technology.

To facilitate all the new phone companies who are currently sharing B.T.'s old network - a new technology has to be introduced. Which are fibre optic cables. This new technology is much more powerful, easier to maintain, and more secure than the old copper system.

It is really annoying for us all to undergo this change - but it is the right thing for all of us in the long term.

The new indoor 'phones are "V.O.I.P" (voice over internet protocol) and function from your broadband - so I believe you can have as many of these phones in your home as you want - as long as you have a broadband signal in those rooms.

Many of us are declining having one or more of these "V.O.I.P." phones, because of the extra expense of renting them - and we are saving money by being "mobile only".

The scary thing is that people who rely on medical alarms - would have their alarms cut off, if their broadband went down. So I don't yet know how the 'phone companies are going to get around this serious problem.

When you say "as long as you have a broadband signal in those rooms" I'm focusing on the word "you" - as in meaning "Your internet connection has to be wireless - rather than wired-up". Am I interpreting that correctly?

How does that multiple phones in a house work out for someone who has wired-up computer and doesnt/won't have wireless. That's confusing me - how one would have a landline phone from a wired-up computer router in a different room - and I'm interpreting it as meaning "wired-up people can't". Have I got that right?

The medical alarms thing is indeed an issue for those who need that sort of facility. Reminder to self to check on the older woman living near me on her own and I know I gave her my contact details - so she can phone me if she has an emergency and I can take it from there until her daughter (an hour car journey away) could get to her. The area I live in now is so remote and appalling NHS service in many respects that my "got to go to A & E" interpretation if I ever needed it is "Phone the local taxi firm I use and get them to drive me back to my home city A & E - that 5 hour drive would probably be a sight quicker/more comfortable than a wait in one of the A & E's in this area - which shock me rigid whenever I hear what they're like - ie totally unacceptable" and I'm absolutely horrified by some of what I've been told about them.

That "Oh you'll have a battery back-up if you ask for it" doesn't cut it when, I gather, the battery only lasts for about 1 hour!!!! That's pathetic. There's no way that would last for several "emergency" calls to local firms etc and even one personal conversation with a long-distance friend. Very primitive technology indeed. When we had a recent electric outage on some housing near me here it was out for a couple of days - and that during cold weather. A long time to not be able to make/receive phonecalls on a landline phone and in an area where it's impossible to follow the emergency plan I always had back in my home city - which I never had to implement once in all those years and it just consisted of two words = "Go out". Out for a place to eat, out for a hotel, out for somewhere social one could just be in....just "Go out" and that was all the emergency plan I needed.

In remote areas (like where I am now) "Just go out" doesn't work as an emergency plan and one has to be able to make phonecalls somehow - as areas like this work more around "The emergency plan is checking out if there's community facilities opened up for people....check if there's anywhere else in the town still working as normal etc". Not everyone can just "phone a taxi and leave the town for however long necessary if things aren't working". I appreciate that few people could in fact. Living in some areas is more "challenging" than many appreciate and that pathetic 1 hour battery worth would vanish in no time at all.

I have seen no mention of DECT phones, only VOIP handsets.

Before changing from copper to fibre, I had two, wireless DECT handsets in the house, one in the upstairs bedroom and one in the kitchen. When Openreach installed my new router, they replaced my two DECT handsets with new ones. The new router includes a DECT module so nothing has changed (except I had to transfer my many landline phone contacts over to the new system).

I mention DECT technology because no-one else has. For those with 'difficult' homes, it should help to improve call quality over VOIP.

I wonder about those complaining about having to dial the 'Area code' when making calls. Surely you save your contact numbers on your phone? Once stored, you don't have to dial anything, just open the contact and press the 'Call'' button. You could also ask Alexa/Siri to call your contact for you.

The other thought that comes to mind is that I don't remember anyone mentioning WiFi calling from a mobile phone. If your mobile signal at home is poor (and you have a modern mobile phone), you can make good quality calls from your mobile via your internet router.

No-one has mentioned the ability to provide satellite phones for remote areas with poor mobile coverage.

Technology moves on - I've been into old exchanges. Old cables were not taken out, newer ones were just laid along the tops of the racks which were buckling with the weight. The buildings housing the generators that provided power needed to keep old landlines active were huge. Maintaining old networks and equipment is costly and unsustainable.

Thank you missed out - it's all helping to clarify what the situation is. You don't surprise me a bit re old cables not taken out when new ones were put in - even when the racks were buckling under weight.

I've been told by a local businessman here that's basically in the "he's nobody's fool category" that they've found they've got the problem here of a substantial proportion of the local exchange has been found to contain asbestos and they're having kittens about it (well the more responsible ones will be - and the errrr...far-from-responsible ones won't be giving a darn as per usual). I've been a little "surprised" by lack of safety precautions I've noticed in a variety of respects round here (scrambling round on the roofs of 3 storey houses/no scaffolding up etc anyone?!!!)/building houses on land even I know has Japanese Knotweed and I've seen no sign of it being properly dealt with anyone?!!!.)

So - goodness only knows what's happening (or not) at that phone exchange...I almost dread to think.

NB; Can you explain in laypersons language what you mean by DECT technology?

Renata - You've reminded us that a lot of our public property is now in some private hands or other - because the Government of the time flogged our property off - grr!!

Guess this is where the chickens are coming home to roost - ie our phonelines being shared with a variety of private companies. Gives them all lots of scope to play "pass the buck" and lots of scope in a country that doesn't function very efficiently anyway (I can say that - as I am British and the inefficiency often appalls me) to try saying that things are down to someone else and not them. Previously - in Normal Times - there would be just the one public supplier and it's obviously their responsibility and they could split costs all round and/or go to the Government to sort paying for it all.

Well we will all survive (some better and more easily than others ) our ears won’t drop off and we won’t fizzle up in a heap We will all get used to the new tech that comes along well nearly all ( except Cariad ) the world won’t stand still for the few people who are wanting to stay in the 1900 s
We get used to it
I use Whatsapp or Messanger to talk for free as long as I like to my overseas relatives and friends why not do that Cariad

There's clearly a massive incomprehension gulf.

- That everyone has Alexa - I can't think of anyone at all that does. Wouldnt have one as a gift - as it's hardly something anyone needs.
- It's double dutch to talk about DECT phones and VOIP handsets. Surely they're both phones and they are both presumably plugged into the router instead of into the phone socket and they both have a problem about "How does one plug a 2nd phone into a 2nd something-or-other in a different room?" and some people don't care what happens to us.
- What's a module when it's at home?

Might as well be talking in a different language.

Me - I want:
- my main phone in my study as per now and I'm being told it has to plug into my new router I'm told I will need instead of into the phone socket. Well that will still work.
- my secondary phone in my sitting room and gawd-alone knows what that is supposed to plug into and the "don't cares" of this world are saying "Tough luck - you've lost it and we don't care if you can't hear your study phone ring in your sitting room. You'll just have to check your study phone at intervals to see if someone you couldnt hear has left a message on your main phone"
- I am going to be paying exactly the same phone/internet bill as I do now - no dearer obviously (ie just because of something that's nowt to do with me and my choices)
- They refuse to have a system available to deal with making landline phonecalls if the electric goes off = tough luck - we expect you to use a smartphone even if you havent got one/dont need or want one/couldnt use it anyway as it's too complex for a non-techno person (and anyway it's a health hazard because of being wireless - hello!!!!). You can take risks with your health if you like - but some of us are certainly not going to do so because other people don't seem to know that fact that they are hazardous or refuse to believe it despite all evidence proving it is.

My head hurts....

CariadAgain

NB; Can you explain in laypersons language what you mean by DECT technology?

Why don’t you ask your ChatBot friend. 🤷‍♀️

I'm merely pointing out VOIP technology handsets are not the only ones available for 'house' phones. If you have poor quality voice calls on your landline substitute handsets, you could ask about different solutions because there are choices. I'm not going to copy the results of a Google search on DECT here.

I've worked in high tech industries for many years before retiring. I don't believe my brain has been fried by exposure to the wavelengths used by telecomms over the last 30 years and I'm getting on. I would, however, keep away from nuclear power reactors.

Times change Cariad in my and many others view, for the better, going backwards, as far as tech is concerned, isn’t possible in most areas, including phone communication.

I'm wondering if come the time I'll have to spend my darn money and hire a private engineer and tell him what I have and ask how I keep it like that - or as near to as I can possibly manage etc. They should know about what's what and - because I'd be paying them quite directly - then care about what's what.

As far as I can tell - I might be able to "play for time" to drag it out for a year or so (which is a noticeable proportion and worth doing at this sort of age I am now and gives them longer for everyone else to "kick up" of the people that do expect decent service and will "say something" if they don't get it - rather than those that just "accept what they're given" (never a category I've been in myself since adulthood LOL).

Might be the best way to play it. After all the electric smart meters have been delayed and delayed again for a lot of us because some people are kicking up about them and trying not to have them.

You won’t be able to delay it, because they will switch off the system at your local exchange, it’s a phased programme, due to complete nationwide by January 2027.

The biggest problem with the changeover is the way BT has handled the whole changeover. Their aapproach to consumers from day 1, has been 'this is what we are going to do and this is when we are going to do it.' They were entirely prepared to leave people in need of emergency lines at all times, without back-up and even when forceed to do so did it with very bad grace

Their publicty has just been airy assurances that it will give us better service than we had before and we will not notice the changeover. We had absolutely no notice that we were goingto lose our landline and have VOIP until the Open reach people knocked on our door.

We were stupid enough to believe the publicity, so it came as a nasty shock when after the changeover phone calls cut out, when I found, if I walked to our utility room or integral garage the phone cut out entirely, despite a house wide mesh system. Events that had not happened with a landline.

We need to remember that BT and the Post Office were once one and that the problems with the PO computer system go back decades and that the cpr[orate culture that led to the dishonourable and aappalling way the Post Office treated is post masters, is part of the BT corporate culture as well. As far as BT is cncerned the consumer pays up and shuts up and talke what it is given.

I think it’s because home telephones are slowly fading out of use M0nica, not that that’s an excuse for poor service, but it is the reality. They probably won’t exist at all in 20 years time.

If you have a reliable mobile signal I really don't see the problem.
We have no mobile signal in our village and rely on WiFi calling, also frequent power cuts. They still swapped us over. It means that if the power goes off we cannot make or receive calls.

We get round that with a device called a ups. Bit like a giant battery. BT paid for it.
It's been tested many times during power cuts and keeps our internet and phones going for at least 6 hours.

Quite M0nica.

I think this situation equates to the WASPI women stealing of State Pension and not even bothering to tell us and some didn't find out until literally weeks away from their expected retirement date of 60.

What we should have had:
- Check out with us how we feel about swopping type of phoneline
- IF the majority of us agreed - then little leaflet/booklet through each door explaining exactly what's what, making it plain we personally wouldnt be expected to cover any costs, telling us about the two different types of housephone and how we could evaluate the correct one for us. We're having to kick/scream/ask questions for information they should have told us anyway and so all we had to do was look down at our leaflet/booklet they didn't produce and say "Answer to this question is here on page 7, paragraph 5. Answer to that question is there on page 20, paragraph 2". etc.

- Plenty of notice when it came to our personal house

I "theenk" (cautious optimism) that maybe a new line itself situation might not be a problem for me after all personally - as my intelligent/techno-capable neighbour has explained to me that I've probably landed up safeguarded in advance on some aspects by the way I had to have my phoneline substantially swopped after I moved here anyway (despite that being 2013 it was still a party line!!!!! and they had to swop it when I kicked up about that). The conversation then started getting rather "technical" and over my head - aided and abetted by his English is good-but not great.

But I'm still concerned re how a 2nd phone away from my router is to keep working and can't see how....fear it may not be possible. I still fear they'll just turn up on the doorstep and expect to bully/assume their way into doing "whatever-it-is" when I'm not going to be there etc etc - and so I won't let them. I live in an area now where a lot of workmen expect there will be a "housewife" available to wait on their requirements and I've had to explain to a lot of them there's no "housewife" anywhere near my house - just a modern "person" who has a life to get on with/may be out etc. But I don't have a "housewife" living here that I can delegate to for their convenience.


I'm still concerned they'll pull a "turn up without warning" stint on me.

I'm still concerned with how one makes phonecalls if the electric is off - extra gadget ! and that gadget (battery) only lasting about 1 measly hour.

How does that song go? "All I want to say is they don't care about us....".

Why don’t you just give up all the fighting snd join the 21 st
Cariad I have a cousin who will be 100 after Christmas she does online learning and calls me for free calls on messenger
I ring my son and family in NZ every Sunday for free I use WhatsApp for free talk as long as you want, anywhere in the world you could talk to your friend in Ireland for as long as you want, free of charge you can send her photos or videos
My best friend is 90 has had a stroke but has her mobile phone and her iPad we exchange photos on her iPad all free of charge and chat as long as we want
It can be daunting at first but you will soon get the hang of it if you just give it a go

Casdon

I think it’s because home telephones are slowly fading out of use M0nica, not that that’s an excuse for poor service, but it is the reality. They probably won’t exist at all in 20 years time.

Home phones may, but landlines were used for a variety of other services including emergency and alarm systems, and if the replacements are as unreliale as our VOIP phone, then that is putting lives at risk.

On a completely separate issue. The design of mobile phones the flat thin screen make it very difficult for anyone with any problems with their hands to use, while the 'landline' style phones with their rounded shape are far easier to hold for any length of time.

You’re right M0nica. You can buy mobile phones which look and feel exactly like landlines, so I don’t think that is a major concern, but alarm system rely on GPS, and link to the alarm network via a mobile network, so are more vulnerable. I think for older and larger buildings you can get a signal booster to ensure all areas are covered, but nonetheless if the mobile signal goes down they don’t work.

On a completely separate issue. The design of mobile phones the flat thin screen make it very difficult for anyone with any problems with their hands to use, while the 'landline' style phones with their rounded shape are far easier to hold for any length of time

There are various aids that help people to hold a mobile phone.
There are voice activated mobiles so no need to hold the phone. Devices like Amazon Echo and Google Home can be used to operate the phone by voice, play calls through the speaker, or hearing aids/headphones.

There are also voice activated phones available.

CariadAgain

Quite M0nica.

I think this situation equates to the WASPI women stealing of State Pension and not even bothering to tell us and some didn't find out until literally weeks away from their expected retirement date of 60.

What we should have had:
- Check out with us how we feel about swopping type of phoneline
- IF the majority of us agreed - then little leaflet/booklet through each door explaining exactly what's what, making it plain we personally wouldnt be expected to cover any costs, telling us about the two different types of housephone and how we could evaluate the correct one for us. We're having to kick/scream/ask questions for information they should have told us anyway and so all we had to do was look down at our leaflet/booklet they didn't produce and say "Answer to this question is here on page 7, paragraph 5. Answer to that question is there on page 20, paragraph 2". etc.

- Plenty of notice when it came to our personal house

I "theenk" (cautious optimism) that maybe a new line itself situation might not be a problem for me after all personally - as my intelligent/techno-capable neighbour has explained to me that I've probably landed up safeguarded in advance on some aspects by the way I had to have my phoneline substantially swopped after I moved here anyway (despite that being 2013 it was still a party line!!!!! and they had to swop it when I kicked up about that). The conversation then started getting rather "technical" and over my head - aided and abetted by his English is good-but not great.

But I'm still concerned re how a 2nd phone away from my router is to keep working and can't see how....fear it may not be possible. I still fear they'll just turn up on the doorstep and expect to bully/assume their way into doing "whatever-it-is" when I'm not going to be there etc etc - and so I won't let them. I live in an area now where a lot of workmen expect there will be a "housewife" available to wait on their requirements and I've had to explain to a lot of them there's no "housewife" anywhere near my house - just a modern "person" who has a life to get on with/may be out etc. But I don't have a "housewife" living here that I can delegate to for their convenience.

I'm still concerned they'll pull a "turn up without warning" stint on me.

I'm still concerned with how one makes phonecalls if the electric is off - extra gadget ! and that gadget (battery) only lasting about 1 measly hour.

How does that song go? "All I want to say is they don't care about us....".

If you read my post you'll see I have answered your questions.
The second phone works just fine. It just plugs in a socket like an old school landline.
The "gadget in case of power cuts" works for at least 6 hours in our case. Might be longer because our longest power cut this year was 6 hours.

I think the battery in my Emergency handset is supposed to be about 8 hours but I don't know if that is when it is in standbye or if it lasts less time if one actually uses it.

The Emergency handsets, when they first came out, tended to connect only to the Emergency Services and the Internet Provider, but I can use mine for any calls if I wish. I just end up paying for them at the Mobile rate, and not on my Call Anytime package.

OldFrill

^On a completely separate issue. The design of mobile phones the flat thin screen make it very difficult for anyone with any problems with their hands to use, while the 'landline' style phones with their rounded shape are far easier to hold for any length of time^

There are various aids that help people to hold a mobile phone.
There are voice activated mobiles so no need to hold the phone. Devices like Amazon Echo and Google Home can be used to operate the phone by voice, play calls through the speaker, or hearing aids/headphones.

Old Frill, I have that problem, with my hand cramping if I use either my wireless landline too long or the rare occasions when I dig out the old Nokia 1200 to let my daughter know my Chiropodist appointment has finished, also difficulty with accurate screen use - just like I really can't use the touch pad on my laptop and rely on a mouse. I have never heard of Amazon Echo or Google Home before.

I have a different issue with the size of the modern Smart Phone. When my daughter hands me hers to look at something, it is completely the wrong size and shape for me to hold comfortably for more than a few seconds.