HRT for the over-60s

Peoples' responses to the menopause vary - some suffer hardly at all and others have symptoms for the rest of their lives. My GP OH often tells me about women in their 80s who still had problems.

If it were not for advances in medicine and longevity we would not have the problem - adult women should be pregnant, breast-feeding or dead! - so few periods and definitely no menopause.

Interestingly there is a school of thought that says that women with severe menopausal symptoms need to be treated with testosterone.

I came off a mini dose of HRT by patch several years ago and life has been difficult ever since - giddiness is the worst symptom, with migraines and hot flushes. I am often tempted to just go back on it - I am 64 with normal BP and weight etc. But I do have a much younger sister who has had breast cancer twice, so that is a concern for us all.

Everyone is different, and HRT is a great trearment for some, relieving them of years of misery and giving them their lives back.

I wonder if it is actually true that in bygone times women were either pregnant, breast feeding or dead, in other words died around 50.

Statistics on average life expectancy might include the high rate of infant mortality that we had in the past.

I must say I am glad I put up with the menopause naturally. I would have been terrified of taking HRT with its possible serious effects.

If they were dead after the menopause, why did the menopause evolve? Very few other animals have it. There is a perfectly valid theory the menopause evolved so that we could live long enough to bring up our last born and there could be..... fanfare of trumpets ...... GRANDMOTHERS who would help their daughter's offspring survive and share their wisdom.

I believe there is evidence that HRT doesn't 'cause' breast cancer.
But breast cancer feeds off oestrogen so if there is a personal or family history of same, obviously HRT should not be taken.
This is how I understand it works so will continue with my Kliofem for as long as I can get it. I would rather take it and face minimal risks (with no personal or family histories) than suffer the awful symptoms which were ruining all aspects of my life.

Some breast cancers grow faster in the presence of oestrogen. Not all. BC is not just one disease it is a whole bunch of different ones. I think these days you can have your lump tested to see if it was the oestrogen sensitive type.

Mine was tested as oestrogen positive, which is why I wonder from time to time about the HRT. And I certainly wouldn't go near "natural" oestrogen these days. But then, there was the heavy duty contraceptive pill in our youth too....

I do not think I could have coped without HRT - the difference it made to my life and the way I felt was unbelievable.

Jess; what happens with other primates if they have a normal lifespan without environmental issues causing their early death in any way?

Their offspring have shorter childhoods than ours Tegan and are able to climb trees etc from a very early age.
Also it is entirely possible that the survival rate of offspring born to different ages of animal mothers vary, particularly in intelligent animals with long lifespans like whales, elephants as well as primates. When mother young and inexperienced they can come to grief. When mother in prime they have their best chance of survival. When mother ageing, again survival drops.
Read something recently about the survival of young male adult orcas - in any year they are less likely to die if mum is still around in the pod.

Here it is - and the mother orcas have a menopause.

www.bbc.co.uk/nature/19561076

I've long been fascinated by the matriarchal society of elephants [ever since watching, over a couple of decades, the lives of Echo and her family]. Damn; there was a programme recently about orcas in captivity and I must have missed it [as I did the programme about butterflies last night].

Very sad when they are kept in captivity tegan. As Barbara Kingsolver points out, if you take an animal like that out of its environment and social group it does not really exist in any meaningful sense.

Thought I was going bonkers [no tv programmes about orcas] but then realised it's a documentary that's on in cinemas at the moment that I was thinking of. It's called 'Blackfish' and points out that there are no known cases of a human ever being killed by a killer whale in the wild; it only happens when they are kept captive.

My mother and two of her friends bought HRT over the internet after their various GP's refused to continue to prescribe for them. Mum had gone through the menopause when she started HRT in her 50's, as had her pals. They were impressed by the tory politician (sorry, her name escapes me) who was such an hrt advocate. Mum eventually stopped taking it about 5 years before she died - she was 87 when she died, and always regretted coming off hrt because her energy levels, memory, arthritic pain etc all became an issue for her.
I have arthritis which went into overdrive when I stopped taking HRT. I am beginning to wish I hadn't stopped taking it. The possible side effects have to weighed against quality of life issues I believe

I know there have always been concerns over too much dairy in ones diet but recently read that problems can be caused by the amount of hormones found in dairy produce. Not sure of all the ins and outs of all this, but I have cut out a lot of dairy produce from my diet recently and am feeling a lot better [but could just be the sunshine and warmer weather]. Mind you, the NHS being what it is I'm sure that soon we'll find that HRT is, in fact, good for us and far outweights any problems it may cause.

They banned hormones in dairy animals 20 years ago tegan and beef cattle as well https://www.gov.uk/cattle-health#hormonal-treatments-and-antibiotics-for-cattle.
I think dangers of dairy are a favourite theme with "nutritionists" and "naturopaths" and the like, without any evidence foundation.

Don't they have a lot of hormones cause they are always pregnant, though, and won't that be in the milk?

Do milch-cows have to be always pregnant? Doesn't it work as in humans – so long as 'milking' takes place, the mammal will continue to produce milk? If that is the case, then once heifers have had their first calf, they can be milch-cows.

I love HRT. I'm on a minuscule dose, but it keeps me on an even keel. I've tried to come off a couple of times, but my DH says I'm easier to live with when I'm taking it! I agree with him - without it I didn't like me either.

For a natural way to help hot flushes associated with menopause take a handful of garden sage leaves. Put into a teapot and add 8 or 9 ounces of hot water. Let it steep for 10 mins and then drink it - you can sweeten it with some manuka honey if you like. Take this tea about 3 times a day and it will really help. Sage also helps with anxiety and stress.

Oh, I do so hate sage! It has a nasty soapy taste. Almost as bad as celery.

Was on HRT for20 years,after being diagnosed with osteoporosis (I was told I could end up in a wheelchair) if I didnt take it.Came off it at 60,at doctors request.Am now 66 and the last six years have been hell.I am in good health and the flushes and sweats have lessened and are bearable.Sex is nowhere near as good since coming off HRT,dry uncomfortable and no desire what so ever,but now I've got terrible itching bits ,has anyone tried progesterone cream,does it stop the itching.My doctor seems reluctant to give me it,but i know you can buy it on line?Docs given me zinc caster oil cream,not much better.Any help would be Apprieciated.

Sympathy from me - I came off HRT 8 years ago, after taking it for about 7 years. My previous GP recommended it as a bone protector, because I have inflammatory arthritis, which goes hand in hand with osteo arthritis. My new GP prescribed one of the progesterone creams, it did stop the itching and made life more comfortable. Unfortanately, I had a very small bleed so had to come off it - it's one of the possible side effects. It's good to see this subject being talked about. I'm with you on the impact on sex life

Iam64 I agree with you wholeheartedly that the quality of life issues far outweigh the possible side effects, assuming a favourable family/personal history. And wonder upon wonders- my prescription for Kliofem is now repeat!!

Fab Reddevil - I wonder how many other mavericks like my mum and her friends buy HRT over the internet when their doctors refuse to continue prescribing. I was with mum, aged 80 ish, when her new GP told her he wasn't prepared to continue to prescribe HRT. She told him he wouldn't dare refuse if she was Theresa gorman or Barbara Cartland. Once home, she phoned her pal, and added her order to the pal's internet list. When my sister's GP recommended she stop HRT, mum told her to take no notice, and said she had loads of spare - there it was, on the shelves in her kitchen cupboards, alongside the bottles of red wine......