Menopause - NICE guidelines

I meant to add ( was trying to do "return" but ended up posting twice!) - hope the biopsies are OK

Gillibob - not sure if you will see this but it is not usual to be given a male hormone to stop the bleeding - this would be testosterone. However some of the synthetic progestogens are derived from testosterone but they are not the same thing! Norethisterone is the most common one given to control bleeding from the uterus. You could have a Mirena coil which will also control the bleeding and also allow you to take oestrogen as well.

Gillibob - not sure if you will see this but it is not usual to be given a male hormone to stop the bleeding - this would be testosterone. However some of the synthetic progestogens are derived from testosterone but they are not the same thing! Norethisterone is the most common one given to control bleeding from the uterus. You could have a Mirena coil which will also control the bleeding and also allow you to take oestrogen as well.

Trenna, I was fortunate to have a problem free menopause as well and I am not vegetarian, although I do eat a lot of fruit and veg. I think it is just good luck rather than any particular life style.

Well things have moved on quite a bit since this thread started newnanny (was it really over 2 years ago??)

A good few months ago I was finally given HRT and whilst I had almost instant relief from the sweats, I started bleeding very heavily (started in June) and I was given male hormones to stop it. Which have worked but caused so many other nasties such as even more hair loss, cramps, spots (on my back and chest), tearfulness and a permanent feeling of doom and gloom. I saw a gynae specialist this week who has removed all medication and performed several biopsies (apparently my womb is worryingly large). As a result of removing the male hormone the bleeding is back with a vengeance and I am quite literally drained. Talk about the devil and the deep blue sea!
My sister is 5 years younger than me and sailed through the menopause (years ago) without any symptoms at all. She persuaded her GP to give her HRT though as she says it keeps her feeling young. I'M NOT JEALOUS !!

Here I am waiting for results of biopsies but dreading them at the same time and feeling and looking like an old hag.

Hope your appointment goes well. Fingers crossed you get the help you need. x

My dh will be so very pleased if I get any sex drive back at all and if i can stay awake all day/evening without falling asleep on sofa.

Gillybob I have finally got a referral to specialist Menopause clinic. It has taken me well over a year and four visits with doctor to get this far. It is Monday 9th 2017 and I am hoping for the oestrogen patch. My blood pressure is high and on medication so my GP, who I am very happy with except on this issue, refused me HRT because of this.

I am most interested in this thread. My GP played stink with me when I asked for repeat of my HRT prescription. I started taking it in my very early 30s following a hysterectomy, I am now 66. He told me that all the research then pointed to CA Breast etc. I showed him the latest research which did not agree with these findings.
I changed GPs , although the same practice, and now take it 9 months out of every 12. I have never had any problems whatsoever and for myself, I would say that everywoman should have it made available as of right, giving her the option to opt out if she wishes to.

Hi Gillybob, if you possibly can,go and see a private gynaecologist. I saw one based in Guildford, I didn't need a GP referral, and got put on HRT at the age of 65. There are some women who continue with meno symptoms indefinitely and for me after 12 years of hell I'd had enough. Sending you a hug.

Hi gill bob....I really feel for you...I too started the menopause at age 45...the severest time was 45 to 50 when I had my last period...however it went on and on for a further seven years 12 years in total....I nearly lost my marriage, it was the most horrendous time in my life, night sweats and hot flushes most of the day and night, depression, crying, anxiety and panic attacks.......I gave in at one point and took hrt for one week and ended up calling the gp uut one night as I was climbing the walls with anxiety and panic....would never wish this on anyone.
I tried every herb under the sun, acupuncture, massage, reflexology, strict diet of natural oestrogen so like yams and vitamins with phytonutrients.....some things I tried did help....but the one thing that really made a difference eventually ( and please be aware, that no natural remedy will ever get rid of all symptom completely) was black cohosh...however you need to take it for a min of two months to start to really notice the difference...I can honestly say it made life bearable again, reduced the sweats and flushes by half...I swear by it....sage dried me up too much, Angus cactus made my nipples really sensitive and enlarged it was quite frightening how I reacted to this one...red clover didn't make much difference....but BLACK KOHOSH, really really made the difference...please try it....pleased to say now 61 and apart from a little warm at night still have fan on...I am normal again...lovely ������

Here it is

Judi123 there was a thread recently about hypothyroidism and still feeling total exhaustion even when on medication. I'll see if I can find it and post the link for you.

It was very helpful.

Also read the bit about UTIs and vaginal oestrogen!

Gillybob I thought of you when I read this draft guidance. I would show it to your doctor. The bit in green above about breast cancer seems clear enough to me. Then I would ask for a referral to a specialist if they still don't agree. You should not have to suffer like this.

I have begged ( and I mean begged) various GP's within my practise for HRT, all of whom have refused. I guess that once the first one said no the rest just went along with his decision, yet none have been able ( or willing) to give me a good reason for their refusal except that they have it on record, from me,that my mum was diagnosed with breast cancer aged 59. At 53 the menopause is ruining life and I am not exaggerating. I am permanently tired, irritable, suffering from hair loss, mood swings,re-occurring water infections, insomnia and horrendous hot flushes and night sweats. I would do anything to feel normal again.

Thanks for your message thatbags. I still (at the age of 70!) feel sadness occasionally, but I think the women who have hormone therapy in their 60s in order to have a child are very odd! And about a month ago I dreamt that I was going to have another baby! Maybe some of all this comes from the fact that, at the moment, we only have two grandchildren who are 16 and 14. I do miss the weight and the breathing of a sleeping baby on my shoulder. Crikey, if I go on like this I shall start crying!

I didn't give the loss of fertility a second thought either, but I know a few friends who did. Menopause symptoms affected me for around eight years, I know it can be even longer.

Anno, no, I know you weren't. I don't doubt that stressful life events exacerbate the hormonal problems either!
Absent, I think the NICE draft guidance above says that about 10% of women have symptoms for ten years. If you have had a hysterectomy but kept your ovaries you have no idea when it has started. I have no idea if this is likely to change the pattern of the menopause.
I can honestly say I never gave the loss of fertility at 42 a second thought. Done that, now get on with the career!

Sorry, Mamie, I had no intention of playing down the very real physical effects of the menopause which I acknowledge I was very fortunate to escape. However, it is true to say that it often coincides with times of stress in one's life and this doesn't make things any easier. My GP put me on a short-term course of anti-depressants after my mother's death and difficulties with OH, for which I was very grateful. It is quite possible that this depression was exacerpated by the concurrent hormonal changes.

suzieb, your comment about grieving is interesting. I hadn't thought of that before. I had my last child, gloriously and happily, in my mid forties and thought of her as my "last good egg". I suppose my experience made acceptance of the loss of my fertility very easy.

I wonder if, in the past when there was no contraception, most women who got as far as the menopause were actually glad when it happened. Most of them will have been sick to the back teeth of producing babies, I would imagine, and glad that it had stopped. Most of us don't have this natural lead-in any more, which must affect the psychological aspect, as you say. I hope you eventually found peace from your grieving process

I am very puzzled. Surely the menopause is the relatively brief change part, when you stop ovulating and having periods. Then you become post-meopausal. I am amazed that women can be menopausal for so many years. In my case, the menopause was about three and a half years – now I am post-menopusal with no symptoms.

Sorry Anno, but I don't buy into that hypothesis. Menopause is a physical process caused by changes in hormone levels. To suggest that it has to do with external events implies that there is an emotional / psychological process which at its worst (not accusing you of this) smacks of the "keep fit and have a positive attitude" remark that I found so unhelpful. In my case there were no major lifestyle changes and the only thing that happened was that the menopause symptoms (particularly hot flushes causing broken nights) got in the way of my doing my very demanding job at the height of my career.
What I like about this guidance is that it doesn't go down that line, recognising that different women have different experiences.
If you didn't suffer palpitations, panic attacks, endless hot flushes, mood swings then you were lucky. Mine came out of a clear blue sky and caused years of misery. It was a hormonal problem that needed medical intervention.
I sailed through pregnancy and childbirth and I was lucky. Fibroids, hysterectomy and a ten year menopause were the downside of my reproductive system.
Now it is over, I feel ten years younger.

It has been suggested-I have read- that the best menopausal body is a little plump because the fat cells can convert hormones into oestrogens and offset the natural fall in these.

It must be significant that the menopause occurs at a time when other great changes are taking place in a woman's and her family's life. For one thing, bereavement becomes more prevalent and as her parents die, she finds herself to be the older generation; for another, it may be the 'empty nest' time when her children leave home for work or study and she may become a MiL and/or a grandmother. In my case, it was also the time when my OH started to 'look elsewhere' and finally left for a slightly younger model. However, I was spared the physical symptoms (apart from some sweaty nights in what was, in any case, a hot summer) of the menopause for which I am profoundly thankful.

When I was being treated at the local hospital for post menopausal troubles (hot flushes etc.) one of the things I found most doctors, including my practice G.P.s, were completely unconcerned about, or even interested in, was the psychological effects. Yes - it was great not to have to worry about contraception, but I really went through a grieving process. I couldn't have a baby any more (not that I was desperate for one) but that process was 'dead' to me and it took me quite a while to come to terms with that.