Teachers feeding hungry children

It is true that there are "hopeless parents" but lets not forget it is the children who we are talking about. Why can't lunches and milk be free to all children up to a certain age (say 10). In the grand scheme of money wasting that seems to be the trend in this country (think Olympics and jubilee) would it really cost that much to ensure all children have at least one decent meal a day during term time? This is 2012 after all.

Oh Jess I hope DS1's teacher didn't label him, he was clinically underweight for most of his childhood and I would feed him well and generously and then buy him sausage rolls and crisps to take to school to try to fatten him up!

Gilly I know you are well intentioned but can you image the outrage if all children were given free breakfast and lunches? Would they be good enough? Would it be right to make children go to school early? Why should the state dictate what my child eats? etc., etc., etc.

Alison you are right about parents getting annoyed if offered things or given advice! As school governors we had a huge debate about what, if any, advice we should give parents about healthy lunch boxes...did the school have the right to ban sweets /chocolates etc etc..the person most vociferous and accusing the GB of supporting a Nanny state was a v middle class parent.

It is true parents have the responsibility to rise their children but do they have the 'right' to support the development of unhealthy eating patterns?? So complex the balance between rights and responsibility!

Well, I wouldn't be outraged and I am sure Gilly meant that the meals would be on offer, not obligatory. If the profit motive were removed, so that the meals were made in school kitchens by staff employed by the school, the meals could be hot, nutritious and not too expensive. There would be no stigma, either.
Outsourcing of many services by schools, hospitals, prisons, etc. has allowed some firms to become incredibly rich and I don't believe that they are delivering good value or good services in many areas. Private prisons are much less successful than state-run prisons. Companies wishing to tender for these contracts don't offer lavish hospitality to ministers out of the kindness of their hearts and many ministers involved in the awarding of contracts are employed by the successful bidders after they leave office. The whole system is rotten but neither this or the last government has shown any appetite for tackling corruption - I wonder why?

I didn't mention breakfasts Alison only lunches and milk. Obviously if parents want to take their children home for lunch or provide a packed lunch that would be fine but at least there should be a free lunch available to those who want/need one.

I do think breakfast clubs are a good thing though (not for everyone) but lets not forget all children don't have parents who work conventional hours. My grandchildren often don't know whether they are coming or going with mum and dads shift patterns.

Gilly oops, misread it, probably because so much has been said about breakfast. Sorry, shouldn't do things in such a rush.

I had to spend hour meeting with the private meals provider when I was a head. The meals were dire and service poor. The women employed by the company to 'prepare' meals in our school kitchen were paid peanuts and not the most on the ball bunch you would wish to meet. The cook had a very tight budget and menu rules that the company said she had to follow. This led to a very odd set of meals for children. The area managers were apparently nutritionists. I wish that we had had the money to do it ourselves and directly employ a cook and kitchen staff but the contract was set by the LA for so many years. Once in place quality plummeted. That is the free market for you!

I see from my newspaper that thousands of people joined a queue for free food in Athens yesterday. An estimated 25 tonnes of fruit and vegetables were snapped up in the space of three hours.

As far as I could see from the accompanying photo no-one in the queue was smoking or eating crisps. Don't know about the flat screen tv though

petallus I saw that on the news last night at it appeared to me that mostly they just took the food and didn't say anything to the generous farmers who were giving them the food. Didn't look to me like they said thank you!

The Mayor of Athens is quoted as saying 'there aren't words enough to thank them' so maybe that's why! [wmile]

I meant

Are hungry people expected to bow and scrape to their providers Alison ? I would have hoped that the food was given generously and without prejudice.

This totally sums up my argument for free school meals for all young children without the need to beg and scrape for assistance.

gilly no I don't expect them to bow and scrape but if anyone gives me anything I always say thank you. Simple courtesy.

A 'thank you' is just good manners, gillybob, hardly bowing and scraping...

Going back to nanaej's comment at 1144, a lot of popular belief about what is healthy food (and otherwise) is bullshit, so I would argue that schools should not police lunchbox contents. Parents may have made deliberate choices that whoever is doing the policing doesn't agree with, but parents should do have that right.

Oops! Crossed posts!

Bags I am surprised at your comment. Yes, there are lots of ridiculous fads around - but when you see kids eating the same 'plate of chips, + sugary bun + fluorescent drink' day after day - it is a concern surely. These kids diets has NO fruit or veg, no protein' but lots of fats and sugars and additives. Not too bad for those who go home to a balanced meal in the evening, but tragic for those who do not.

And kids with a lunch-pack that included a bag of crisps, some biscuits and a Mars bar, day in, day out - and who do not get a good breakfast, nor a balanced meal at home. Should it be the right of parents to provide a diet devoid of all vitamins or proteins, etc, but full of fat, salt and sugars + additives?

Surely as a Society we need to protect children. From abuse of any kind, include 'food' abuse- to some extent?

Oh yes, jura, I'm not saying there aren't unhealthy food choices, especially such sugary things as you mention. But there is a lot of nonsense talked about perfectly healthy food as well, especially, in my opinion, with regard to animal fats. As a parent I have the right to feed my child butter rather than low fat vegetable marg for instance, if I so choose, and it's no-one else's business.

I'm in two minds about the children who are given too much sugar and not enough in the way of vitamins and minerals in their diets. I think a school's role should be limited to educating children about food values and a balanced diet, without being too restrictive. The aim of that education would be to give them the means to make good choices (if they so choose) when they are in charge of their own food.

I'm really not sure about interfering in what parents do, even when the parents appear to whoever is judging to be incompetent. The easy answer is educate the parents as well, but of course there never is an easy answer. To my mind there is no need for anyone who can read to be ignorant of the basic food values of foods – calorie content, protein, carb, fat, minerals, vitamins, etc. The information is everywhere!

I do it too, but I really think we should try not to judge too harshly people who do things differently from us.

bags most parents send OK lunches but I have seen a whole packet of Jammie dodgers and a jam sandwich as the only content of a 5yr olds lunch box! I know if kids are picky eaters you need them to eat something but there is also a case for encouraging a better diet and not pandering to a limited one..
All we ever said for packed lunches was no sweets and chocolates..best kept for a treat at home. I would have liked to ban hula hoops..it took kids ages to eat them by the time they put them on their fingers and then nibbled them off!

Swift's "modest proposal" was that the children of the poor should be food for the rich. Looking at our present situation in the UK, that's exactly what's happening today when the rich (our shameless government included) feed on the poor, especially on the children of the poor. When I see the obscene amounts of money (from our taxes) wasted on the jubilee and the olympics, my blood pressure goes right off the Richter scale
Yes, feed the children, not the bankers.

I agree bags - so difficult to know where to put that 'fine' line.
At the schools I taught at- it was heart breaking to see the children who we knew had free school meals- making the worst possible choices at the canteen. As said before, a daily plate of chips with ketchup, a bag of crisps, with a sugary bun or chocolate dollops and a fluorescent drink. Again - the saddest thing was that we knew there wouldn't be a balanced meal later at home either. And YES, it does have an influence on behaviour and learning, honest.

One could also say that it went totally against the basic idea of free school meals, eg that children from under-privileged families would receive form the State (us tax payers) a properly balanced meal and the necessary vitamins, proteins, and other things required. Remember those mums shown on TV news taking MacDonalds for their teenagers and handing them through the gate on days when chips were not for sale at the school. Tragic. Jamie Oliver has my vote. It is difficult for British and US people to see that they are unique in this.

In France for instance, schools have a proper menu and kids have to choose one of two choices for a starter (2 types of salad), a main meal including a choice of 2 (say meat or fish), then a carb (rice, pasta or potatoe) and a pud (piece of fruit, yogurt, mousse) = a 'proper' balanced meal.

I very much agree with Bags that we should try not to judge too harshly people who do things differently from us.

I hate to say it but there can sometimes be quite a lot of that judging going on on Gransnet.

I am so sorry if you thing this is 'judgement'. There is absolutely nothing wrong in doing things 'differently' - nothing wrong with butter or margarine, or organic whatsits. But children fed on chips, chips, more chips with crisps and sugary buns and cakes - is just wrong, because it is slowly making those kids ill, and will lead to all sorts of problems in the long-term. We as a society should try and address this. There is no point in the State (us) spending millions on providing free school meals for those who need it - and feed them more unhealthy rubbish, is there?

Perhaps you need to see it happening, day in, day out - to understand what I mean, and how tragic it is. We tried at our school to have a few days a week without chips- but the children just didn't have school meals on those days, and went down the road to the chippy!

At one school where I worked Infants (KS1) were not allowed to bring a packed lunch. All kids ate the properly 'prepared from scratch' dinners and most asked for seconds..meat/fish & 2 veg /pots/rice/pasta followed by a pud; cake & custard, fruit and cream, rice pud. I strongly believe that kids have to be trained to eat different foods so they can make choices...

when they could choose to have a packed lunch very few chose to do so.

To be honest, I wouldn't describe children eating chips every day as 'tragic' though I agree it might not be ideal.

Difficult to know when it is appropriate to intervene/interfere in other people's lifestyles. To some, eating burgers, chips, chocolate and so on is a normal way to go on.

I'm afraid there have been quite a few judgemental comments on this thread about supposedly inadequate/ feckless parents.