Clegg thinks pensioners should give up benefits

I wonder if Clegg's goose is well and truly cooked? His "apology" was risiculous, his input is toxic - I can't see anybody supporting him on anything ever again. Bring on Boris!!!

cross there between "risible" and "ridiculous" - quite a good word though

Another good word gracesmum, I just invented one on another thread. Maybe they deserve a thread of their own. But before I go off on another track I must just go and get some work done!

I would get rid of all the extras over and above the pension for all older people. I think they are patronising and demeaning suggestion that we are incapable of managing our incomes unless we are given little bits of extra money carefully ringfenced against us wasting the money for heating, for example, on sweet tea and biscuits.

Before every one rises in revolt saying how hard this would be on poorer pensions. I realise that and I think that can be mitigated by increasing the minimum pension that qualifies for Pension Credit by say £10.00 a week. This would cascade through the Pension Credit system givng everybody on all forms of pension credit more money and bringing other people within the Pension Credit system. Better off older people would not get any extra money This would save all the money spent administrating the bus pass, heating allowance etc etc for each little extra we get.

This would not stop bus companies offering reductions to older people if they wanted to, just as the railways run the Senior Citzen, but it would mean we could choose how to spend our money. As it is some older people benefit from the extra benefits and others dont depending on their age,location and life style. I live in a rural area and dont have a bus pass because I am travel sick on buses and never willing travel by bus. I would prefer to spend my money on a Railcard or running my car.

Interesting post FlicketyB. I agree with what you say.

I agree with the other comments. I am retired and pay taxes! If I did not have my bus pass I would use my car more, thus contributing to environmental pollution. Loneliness and isolation are likely to increase if people cannot get out and about. Means testing would be socially divisive as many people do not want it to be obvious that they are getting so called hand-outs when others don't. I remember my mother refusing for a long time to claim pension credit which she was entitled to receive. She did not everyone knowing her financial status.

The 'winter fuel payment' like the £10 'Christmas present' pensioners get is not ring fenced, it can be spent on anything since it comes in the form of a payment into the bank account. I hardly ever use my bus pass but I do get free prescriptions as I imagine a lot of us do. But I agree with Petallus, a regular increase would be far better than lump sum largesse. And the winter fuel payment is for the household, not for the individual.

None of the extras (winter fuel allowance, bus pass, etc.) is taxable.

Surely if the winter fuel allowance is paid directly into your bank account it will be classed as income, and taxed accordingly?

As the only benefit I get is the WTA, and I still pay tax at source on my Teacher's and Civil Service pensions, I would welcome a rise to compensate for losing benefits!

Please disregard my previous post - I was talking rubbish!

There is no tax VAT etc attached to grants which the winter fuel allowance is.

As most of you have said, it is highly unlikely that any OAP, who is well off, would apply for a bus pass or even want to be seen traveling by bus. So that sorts the bus pass problem out.
As to the fuel allowance and TV license -information is so readily available these days that means testing should not be required. A study of the records at HMRC to find those paying over a given amount of tax will sort out those that don't need help. I don't want to hear all the excuses about the cost of means testing - there are simpler and cheaper options - it must be news to some that we're living in the digital age now!!!

Perhaps part of the problem is that MPs seem to be so Londoncentric? If you live in London you get a Freedom Pass which allows you to travel free on the underground as well as the buses. I heard an MP a couple of months ago refer to the Freedom Pass as something we all get! Many pensioners live in areas which don't have very good public transport and therefore don't use their bus passes as much as those in urban areas and therefore their local authorities don't have to pay out so much.

I only saw NC on TV briefly but it seemed to me he was only talking about really rich pensioners so many/most of us would not be affected.

If we all protest long and loud near the election they won't dare put it in their manifesto as we are the ones who vote!

But then they might completely ignore what they said in the manifesto.

Oh, never lily!

And then we could make a lot of fuss and force them to change their minds. Done a lot of that recently!

This is another of this coaltion's brainless ideas. I wonder what tomorrow's will be? I had high hopes of this coalition but they're just like all the rest of 'em. I learned today that an elderly lady with a broken collarbone was sent home from hospital at 4 am and had to pay £45 for a taxi for the privilege! That's the sort of indignity a government should be focusing on. Instead they shower further indignities upon them - us!!!! I wish I could hear and see their reactions when they become elderly and infirm. We're told we can show our dismay at the ballot box, but the other lot aren't any better either!

When they are elderly and infirm they'll have private health care, goldengirl - real life won't touch them even in their dotage!

I can't get on and off public transport (apart from Cunard ships) so don't have bus pass!

Lilygran, you suggested above that bus passes only cost money if they are used. Do you know that for a fact? On our buses, I just wave my pass at the driver as I board the bus. No ticket is issued so they don't appear to keep any records of the number of journeys made using a pass.

I wrote to my local council to inquire about this last year but was told it was nothing to do with them. Bus passes are controlled and issued by the local transport authority.

Does anyone know how bus passes are paid for? I suspect they each cost a fixed sum of money, whether they are used or not

Perhaps MPs should give up some of their own perks - Osborne, Gove and Vaizey had free £175 tickets to a Wagner opera which meant they had to leave work at 4 pm. as it was over five hours long (rather them than me!). Prescott was very keen to take 'working' trips to tropical places where he could pursue his hobby of scuba diving. And as for Cherie Blair.........the queen of freebies.

Grad I assumed that it was the same everywhere since it's a national system now. Silly me We have to show our bus pass or swipe it on buses where the swiping technology exists and get a ticket if it doesn't. I imagine they must charge a standardised fee for every bus pass issued where the system is different. Even so, why bother to get one if you aren't going to use it? I don't imagine people who never go on public transport would.

I'm not sure how the system works but do suspect that a bit of 'creative accounting' occurs.
I sometimes get the bus from town to my nearest stop (cost about £1) I am often given a ticket that is for the entire journey (cost about £6).
I'm sure I've mentioned this before!
I wonder whether the bus company 'claims back' the cost of tickets, in which case they would be claiming too much for my journey, or whether as Lilygran suggests they charge a standardised amount for each bus pass issued.

My sister has a very vain friend who is 76 but refuses to apply for a bus pass because it would make her look old.