Clegg thinks pensioners should give up benefits

Pensioners are an easy target and such attacks chime with a mood of inter-generational warfare promoted by some politicians and some branches of the media. Anyone would think that we arrived on this planet as demanding pensioners rather than contributed thirty, forty, fifty years of work and taxes first.

Such attacks are incredibly lazy. The free television licence doesn't clock in until the age of 75, I think, but he makes it sound as if all pensioners automatically get it. Talking abut Lord Sugar's bus pass is just naughty. You have to apply for a bus pass; it isn't just issued automatically so of course he doesn't have one. However, I suppose he does automatically get the winter fuel allowance.

With one breath Lib Dems are saying that means testing is too costly and inefficient and with the nest are suggesting that "rich" pensioners shouldn't get these perks or that they should be taxed.

Round here all bus passes run out early next year and no-one knows what is going to happen then. Well, I suppose 'they' know but they haven't told us!

I can't believe that Nick Clegg cites Alan Sugar as a pensioner who doesn't need a bus pass. I'm sure Lord Sugar realises this himself and would never apply for one.
The scheme is, I'm sure 'self-regulating' with wealthy pensioners opting out of their own accord.
The cost of 'means-testing' pensioners would negate savings made by withdrawing this 'perk'.
The grey pound seems, at the moment, to be going a long way towards propping up the economy.
To use the OG and I as examples:
We use our bus passes to visit the cinema, galleries, shops and restaurants in a nearby city. Each time we use the bus it is full of O.A.P.s doing much the same.
This city is where Don Foster is M.P. He also queries the bus-pass perk.

Absent I took such a long time typing this that our posts have crossed!

OGM I think it was Don Foster on Radio5 yesterday saying that he didn't think he should be entitled to WFA as he has enough money to manage without and all pensioners on his income level should also manage without.

I loved Lord Sugar's riposte in the Telegraph:
'The Labour Peer said "The twit Nick Clegg moaning about me having a bus pass. Idiot, I don't have one." '

Like OGM says, we use our bus passes for nice little trips and spend money in shops and cafes - these businesses would lose out if we all stayed home and counted our dwindling funds instead!

What do they consider "wealthy" Many of us live in houses which we have paid for, through years of hard work, which are worth a lot of money. Many of us have saved through our working lives in order to make some provision for our old age. Like many others my savings are invested to provide me with an income - even with my state pension my income is less than one tenth of that of an MP's salary! If the benefits were stopped I would have to use those savings, meaning that in a few years time I would have to claim more benefits in order to just survive!

There was a report recently that pensioners who use a bus pass are healthier than those who don't because they get out more. If pensioners have to pay the full bus fare they won't go out as much, not be as healthy and could become ill and as a result use up the resources of the NHS.

We have had suggestions that pensioners should give up their homes for young families, give their winter fuel allowance to students to help them with their fees, use their pension pot to guarantee mortgages and now give up their winter fuel allowance and bus passes. This is just mean and petty!

Perhaps the Lib. Dems. would be happy if everyone who wasn't an MP was given a lethal injection at age 65!

I believe Alan Sugar is a keen cyclist so, if he chooses to have and use a bus pass [which I very much doubt he will as he'd have everyone on the bus chuckling and saying 'you're fired' to him] he deserves it as he protects the enivironment in another way. Except he probably travels in a chauffeur driven limo the rest of the time. If I do get a bus pass next year [I'm not holding my breath] I'll use it to go into town and spend the money I would have spent on fuel and parking to have a meal and a cup of tea, something I can't afford to do now on top of paying to get there. Do they not get it; take away bus passes and the shopping malls and cinemas will be empty. I despair. Especially as fuel hikes etc are supposedly to 'protect the environment'.

I don't suppose many MPs use buses and particularly don't use rural buses which are a) essential for pensioners who don't drive or can't afford a car and b) much more expensive than city buses. They make these utterances without knowing what they are talking about.

A bus pass is only useful to those who use it. If you're so wealthy you have a chauffeur (Alan Sugar), it isn't much of a perk, really, is it, Nick!

Tory backbencher (is his name really Mark Reckless??! What a name!) has said they will fight this proposal - funny that isn't it, seeing as it was his party who put the "granny tax" in their budget in the first place!

www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/liberaldemocrats/9567254/We-will-fight-Nick-Cleggs-granny-wealth-tax-say-Tories.html

Barrow Re your last sentence – Don't give the Lib Dems any ideas!

The heating allowance has also been mentioned - now that really would make a difference to some people.
To be honest I think that the Treasury is looking at all the benefits enjoyed by the pensioner - batton down the hatches!

Pensioners, children, the sick and disabled....soft targets.

Some idiot on the radio this morning asked why millionaires should have free bus passes. I wonder how many millionaires use the bus anyway. Now, I really must get round to cancelling my Lib Dem membership. It isn't the party I helped to create.

What planet is Nick Clegg living on?

He acts as though pensioners are living off tax payers. Pensioners are tax payers like everyone else. Everything we have we have worked and paid taxes for.

Wealthy pensioners? As said by other posters, very wealthy pensioners wouldn't claim benefits any way and certainly wouldn't use buses.

If he wants to cut down on benefits, start looking at benefit cheats of working age and who may never have paid taxes! Save money by stopping the waste in government departments.

I only have money to throw around because I still work, age 68! If I didn't ,I wouldn't be able to go on cruises etc? I also think I'd be bored to death ! What I'm going to do when I have to retire on 4 years time I don't know!

It's interesting that the only people who still seem able to enforce the retirement age although age discrimination is illegal , are the Ministry of Justice!

jeni I'm also still working (nearly 67!) and intend to carry on as long as possible. I need the money and will certainly not be a wealthy pensioner when I finally retire. After all I'm still paying taxes, so surely I should be entitled to some benefits when I do retire.

Clegg is a total a**e as are all the other politicians who court us before elections, cream off as much as they can while in parliament, (legally and otherwise), set their own salaries and pay offs, threaten us with penury (unlike themselves) and preach at us when their own morals and behaviour would make any decent person blush. If I were Nick Ckegg's mum or gran I would just be ashamed.
The bus pass is such a tiny thing - these buses run anyway, don't they? If services were cut back there would be increased unemployment among transport staff as well as hardship for all those who use public transport as a necessity. Free TV licences probably cost as much as the Hobnobs consumed at Cabinet meeting (if not less) and once you introduce means tested benefits, they cost more to implement. This may be worthwhile where large sums are involved but not for paltry amounts such as these. Oh, "disgusted of Tunbridge Wells" - make room for me on your soap box! to the power of infinity.(Don't know symbol for that!)

It would help the suggestion forward if Clegg had any idea how much use is made of bus passes (!) by the rich pensioner. They only cost money if they are used. Same applies to winter fuel allowance and TV licences. I know a number of people who simply pass on the fuel allowance to a charity of their choice. And you don't get the licence free unless you apply for it. As Frank Field pointed out this morning, they pay taxes on their income - not directly on the state pension but on their other income. Do the very rich make any use of state welfare? It would be nice to know!

Hi Lily
Nick Robinson did a programme last year called 'Your money and how they spend it'.
I found this link when looking for it.
If you scroll right down you will find the chart that Nick showed in the programme.
Basically households with a disposable income of between £8K and £24K get the most benefits.

Don't the bus companies charge local councils for them? I thought that was the problem. Anyway, they can't be used at certain times of day. I live in a village and a lot of local people use the bus to go to the doctors in the nearest town.

How often does that viper Clegg suppose millionaire pensioners use the bus.

Thanks, Jane that was very interesting. It also seems quite equitable. How do households with less than £8K disposable income manage?

Also, Clegg is very optimistic talking about standing again as party leader. If he doesn't get in, the Lib Dems will lose the seat and may never get it back!