Jimmy Savile

Half a dozen times at least I have started to post about things long forgotten (involving rock stars, music/record people and Catholic priests) and then deleted. (How bizarre were my teenage years?) I'm not the least bit traumatised and I'm very unsure that abuse is the right word but I simply don''t want to talk about it. At the same time I have very strong feelings about genuine abuse and the importance of coming forward to prevent its recurrence. This is not a cut-and-dried issue and is far more complex than the way it is presented.

In defence of greatnan - not that she needs it! - catholicism is a religion where the priesthood is encouraged (indeed required) to repress their sexual instincts, which is not healthy, so the possibility of an unhealthy influence is there. It is not that all priests were/are abusers, it is just that the climate is set for the possibility.

Bit off topic, but anneandgraham I was in a seminar earlier this week and the language that we use in relation to addiction and families came up: "dysfunctional"; "enabler"; "co-dependent" being just some of them. Interesting, made me think and I decided never going to use dysfunctional again. We are all just doing our best to be functional most of the time!

Greatnan

He was a high profile catholic.

I did not mean it to read like that and I am sorry if that is what you saw. We don't actually know how many children were abused by priests but I am sure there were very many who have still not spoken of it. Not all abused children become abusers, of course, but it seems all abusers have been abused.

hate the word dysfunctional in relation to families!!

Expect that is what we are maybe with having lost our daughter and grand kids!!

I am practising Catholic, it does insense me as of course most priests are absolutely fine they do vary in other ways just like anyone, is a very big issue.

Of course Church of England clergy have record of abuse also but they do not have to be celibate which I suppose makes it less controversial.

I have no idea what religion J Saville was but am sure did not contribute to his alleged child abuse.

I think the post
He was a catholic - I wonder if anything similar happened to him in his childhood? does imply an acceptance that this would not be unusual.

I have always enjoyed and respected your postings greatnan and have admired you for standing up for your views. I just think that this time, what could be construed as a casual throw away remark, is overloaded with an implicit assumption that it would be natural to make this leap.

This is not personal on my part. I am not a practicing catholic, but had you said
He was black/a jew/an aetheist - I wonder if anything similar happened to him in his childhood? there may have been a more indignant reaction.

I am quite sure that nobody has suggested for one moment that all catholic children have been abused - I wasn't! Nor has anybody suggested that all priests are abusers. One must not extrapolate from one remark!

Not controversial at all glitabo. Thank goodness most children enjoy their childhoods in safe, loving circumstances. It's difficult to discuss any subjects without making some generalisations, but anyone with an ounce of common sense will use information wisely and not apply it irresponsibly.

glitabo I am against ALL generalisations of any sector, i.e. gender, race, sexuality, religion etc. They are (I feel) the product of a very ignorant and closed mind.

This may be controversial, but just as not all celebs are abusers, not all catholic priests are abusers and not all catholic children were abused.

All the research has found that 100% of child abusers have been abused, emotionally, physically and/or sexually themselves. From the little known about him, he came from a dysfunctional family and was overly protective towards his mother. There was a lot of gossip about the relationship being 'unnatural.' He said more than once that he shared his mother's bed. I won't make assumptions, though, because i have known of men who did this to protect their mother from a brutal husband. Additionally, he moved in a circle of extreme promiscuity.

However, none of this excuses him. The vast majority who are treated brutally do not sexually abuse others.

Abusers. My iPad doesn't like abusers. Types a users?

A lot of a users have themselves been abused.

He was a catholic - I wonder if anything similar happened to him in his childhood?

From the sound of it, he never at any time thought he was doing anything wrong!

I wonder, if in some distorted way, he thought he was redeeming himself by doing 'good works'? Though, while he was doing the good works, he was still carrying out foul deeds.

Money talks

Probably been said many times in this thread, but can I ask, if so many people knew about him and his deviant behaviour, how in heavens name did he get a knighthood?

(oh yes, just seen your post merlot) Answers anyone?

grannylin pogs

Me too glass.

Someone mentioned on another forum that their father was a policeman in the met years ago and they all knew what was going on.

Yes!

Can he be posthumously stripped of his knighthood?