Should Ian Brady be declared sane.....

kitty I see in the media to-day it has been reported that he does make himself toast and drink soup and that the people who look after him turn a blind eye to this,I do think he enjoys the media attention,I also think he should not be allowed to bring these requests re his starvation to the courts and made to serve his sentence.

Until he discloses where the other body is he should be kept alive.

Brady might not now be mentally ill - I don't know, but guess we'll find out in due course. If he has a dangerous and severe personalty disorder (DSPD) he can still be detained in Ashworth under the Mental Health Act.

I don't understand why he thinks he'll be able to starve himself to death in prison. The prison Safer Custody policy ensures prisoners are cared for by trying to prevent suicide and self harm, and any number one governor who was asked to take Brady would want assurances about him not being enabled to kill himself in their prison. He's kiddng himself if he thinks he's going to get his own way.

I suppose it's up to the psychiatrists to declare whether he's insane or not.

In the court drawings of Brady the nasogastric tube is in place - if he really wanted to die of starvation surely he would repeatedly pull this out.

Like Hindley, I think he's a supreme manipulator.

I'm not convinced he does believe he can starve himself to death in prison. I suspect he is seeking publicity to feed his narcissistic belief about how special and intelligent he is. If he really does want to die, I believe he would have made some serious suicide attempts, and so far as I'm aware, he hasn't. I don't know if he is currently suffering from a treatable mental illness. He does have a dangerous and severe personality disorder, which is believed to be untreatable. He must be detained in whatever secure establishment the tribunal concludes is right for him. I was a child during his murderous spree, and have met police officers involved in the investigation, who were reduced to tears by the tapes etc he and Myra Hindley made. It's frustrating but not surprising that his man still attempts to control others, he is who is he and I don't believe any intervention will change that. I also don't believe he has the right to demand where he serves his life sentence. As so many people have said, he cared nothing for the rights of his victims or the people who loved them.

Brady's perception of his status in the media seems to be his main point. It's reported that he claimed today he is the one remaining high profile patient in the system. He's wrong. He has the hallmarks of a deluded psychopath. He sees himself as special and allowed privileges that other criminal patients don't get. Surely he should have cottoned on by now that his every word and deed is recorded and discussed simply because he is a very high risk patient. If he he should be assessed as recovered from mental illness, and his risk to himself and others is lowered, he would be more likely to be transferred to a regional medium secure hospital, especially if a prison governor isn't prepared to take the risk of him trying to end his life.

Yes, agree with you Iam64. Brady is treated as any other patient in Ashworth, many of whom have delusions of grandeur.

He should not be allowed to have his own way. If he is declared insane, he should stay at Ashworth.

I doubt very much if he would be able to remember now where that little boy was buried as it happened so long ago. The moors have obviously changed over the years and he has not been a regular visitor to observe those changes.

I agree with your post, Iam64.

Isn't it ironic that two adjoining threads are looking at the issue of men who may be near to the end of their lives. Mandela, who the world is trying to cling on to, and Brady.

I am really livid with BBC and press for giving this arch manipulator so much 'air space'. It should be treated as a minor criminal/mental health issue and confined to back pages. Yes, its important we learn what is decided but to let him manipulate things still by what he does and does not disclose is vile. Sorry, on this matter I have no compassion.

I'm sure we all find Brady's crimes repugnant and deplore the fact that he is being given a platform to air his disgusting views, but the matter at hand is very clear cut. The tribunal's only responsibility is to determine whether he has a treatable mental disorder. No other matters can be considered nor can any bargains be struck such as asking him to reveal the whereabouts of Keith Bennett's body in exchange for his transfer. If he is deemed to be sane then he can no longer be force fed and he would in theory be able to starve himself to death. However, like others I have no belief that this is his intention.

I think it does us credit as a country and a society that we treat him with the respect he failed to show to his victims. That is what makes us better than him.

I agree with you Hilda he should not be given all the publicity he craves. Imagine how he would feel if none of this were reported.

Listening to The World at One, I too felt he was manipulating both the media and the system. My flesh creeps when I think of his arrogance and how people are bending over backwards to be fair to him. He is totally delusional IMHO, an arrogant self-seeker who is probably sane in the exaact sense of the word but not like any normal person. I think Nightowl has summed it up perfectly in her last 2 sentences. But how I wish he could just be left to fester in some oubliette somewhere.

He killed, he says, for the existential experience! The arrogance is unbelievable!

Let him carry on - they're paying out the rope for him to tie himself up in knots with. He sees himself as superior and highly intelligent. Obviously not that bright, as the psychiatrists he is so scathing about will all go home to their families every night, whereas he has wasted his life.

Incredible that heis given so much respect even down to him eating toast and soup,and nurses not wanting to embarrass him on 'hunger strike'

Would that he had shown any remorse to his victims.

I will not Want to Read the biography his long term visitor is intending to publish after hs death too macabre for words

Has it not occurred to him that if he gets to prison, someone may well end his life for him?

From what we have heard of his ramblings in Court he seems to be exactly the same manipulative sadist he always was. He complains about having no control over his life, but can't see that that is the point. The worst thing for someone like him is to have his whole life run by other people, and I for one am quite happy for that to continue for as long as possible. When you think of the tape recordings that were played at his trial and compare them with his comments about the murders being like Wuthering Heights you know that hanging was too good for him.

Nightowl - I agree totally with your last couple of sentences. As a society we have to treat everyone with humanity and within the law. He is rightly locked up for life but his legal challenge to incarceration in Ashworth has to be allowed. We'd all prefer the money it's costing to be spent on improving life for children for example, but we are at least working within the legal and ethical framework. That's something Brady wouldn't understand at all.

I agree we should be fair and ethical and then hire a helicopter to deposit him gently on Saddleworth Moor one foggy November night with some toast and packet soup. Just dreaming about natural justice. Never happens.

I never was one of the flog 'em and hang 'em brigade but this is one exception.

Yes, Stansgran and Charleygirl I'm with you there.

We get some bits and pieces of British news from time to time (lots of it royal but also other stuff). I was surprised to see a news report about this loathsome man on New Zealand television and think we could have done without it. He strikes me as being as insane as ever, if not more so.