HS2 rail - any fans?

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-24011403

Certainly some of the huge cost - which is likely to grow exponentially, because it always does - could be spent on upgrading the present network. As long as rail companies have limited - life franchises, there is no incentive for them to invest in the infrastructure.
As usual, my cynical question is - who stands to gain financially from this huge investment?

I think it's a good idea in principle.

I'm not sure about this. I wonder whether upgrading the present network would be the better option. I live in north Manchester, the trains into Manchester are over full and grubby much of the time. Rail links could be improved, or could they> The roads are so overcrowded, the motorways especially are increasingly traffic jams at busy times. Driving north or south on the M6 is usually a stop/start experience.
Train and other forms of public transport seem very expensive.

My husband and his group of friends are all pro HS2 and they use the railways much more than I do. I read recently that one of the advantages would be to extend the commuter belt for folks who work in London, but can no longer afford to live there. I was irritated by that, as I feel the north west, north east are already suffering from the way in which business is so london centred. I'm sure the same applies to Wales, though I know nothing about rail links between Wales and London.

Will HS2 improve work opportunities in the north west, north east, wales, and other parts of the country that are really struggling?

Complete waste of our money.
A train that rarely stops can be of little use to the public in general.
Most can get to London in about one and a half hours, who needs to get there faster, particularly when business is being conducted on the train anyway.
When major cities are connected, the main commerce gravitates to the capitol city anyway, doing little for the satellites.
Don't start me on the rape of the countryside and the people who are about to lose their houses.

The one in Kent is horrendously expensive, beyond the reach of ordinary folk. I cannot think that the proposed new one would be any cheaper?

I am vehemently against it and support 'stop hs2' the national campaigning group against this proposal. There is, as they say, no environmental case, no business case, and no money to pay for it. I only hope that the number of influential individuals and groups now coming out against it will finally bring the plan to a halt before it's too late. My son uses the train a lot for business and he thinks it is pointless.

I agree with deserving and nightowl 100%!

People thought the canals and then railways and then motorways were a bad idea, not to mention bypasses.

If there really is no business case and no money for it, it won't happen.

Let's hope not. Before too much damage is done. The upheaval around people's homes whilst this is constructed will be unbelievable, let alone the devastation caused to the countryside by the project itself. The existing railway system is in urgent need of modernisation and investment, think what this amount of money could do if spent on that. And reopen local stations. And for goodness sake, take the railways back into public ownership.

Initially I thought it seemed like a good idea. Spending money on railways rather than roads appeared to be a step in the right direction. But the more I've read and heard about it, the less convinced I am.

It won't make a huge time difference and, as others have said, it won't serve many of the towns on the way so it seems a lot of money to spend just for business people rather than communities as a whole.

I agree with Iam64 - it is the north that needs to attract work and if this scheme ends up benefitting the south again, it is really unfair and stupid.

I'm hoping it will be scrapped and the money spent on upgrading current networks.

Actually SIL would benefit from HS2 as he regularly has to get the early morning train from Birmingham to London, often getting home again at 11, so anything that shortens his journey would help him. However.....speaking generally I think it is a terrifyingly expensive project both in economic terms (and spiralling out of control already it seems) and environmentally. The bottom line is that so much of our country is London-centric and we arte just not the right shape . That said the fast trains (HS1?) built for the Eurotunnel link were decried and now taken for granted and seen as a Good Thing. I just don't know.Flippantly, someone said once that if you watned to get to London/Birmingham sooner, why not set out half an hour earlier?

I really can't see how it is going to revitalise the northern cities, which seems to be their main argument. Relocating some government offices there would be more useful probably. Swansea is, I hope, eternally grateful for the jobs in the DVLA. Milton Keynes has just acquired the network rail HQ (not a cheap project...) and the city will benefit from jobs and money spent there. But there are still a lot of gov offices based in London in hugely expensive office space. Like DEFRA in Victoria for instance.

The mandarins are not going to move out of central London without a fight.
As far as I have been able to discover, the new line would save some business people possibly 30 mins off a journey from London to a Northern town. I can't see it being much use for the average family visiting relatives or going on holiday.

It's an awful lot of money to save 30 minutes.

Ok this thread has convinced me - I'm joining the NO camp. Like others, I was pleased that the government were looking to other forms of transport than motorways and roads. Jess M makes a good point about moving some of the government offices to the north west and east. Though, I expect greatnan is right to say the mandarins won't move without a fight. I've been entertained by the fuss about the BBC moving some of its staff to Salford. You'd think some of the Londoncentric staff were being asked to do a stint on the moon. Subsequently I've heard presenters on Radio 5 being positively glowing about the benefits of the move. Sadly, most of them seem to have bought in south Manchester, Wilmslow and Hale feature a lot. They've joined the footballers, lawyers and others with huge salaries. If they'd look to north Manchester, they could live within half an hour's drive of Media City and the hot spots of the wonder that is Manchester. They could enjoy the wild and open countryside around here. I lived in south manchester briefly, I loved the easy social life and companionship but I couldn't walk my dogs easily. I was still riding then, and tried several places but we always seemed to end up on a grass verge, at the side of a busy road - so back to the fabulous bridal paths and moorland on the other side of the city. House prices are half those in Didsbury and Wilmslow - and we have Bury Market, what could be better.......

They do not need to move the senior civil servants but some of the back office routine functions of government departments could easily be moved out. They do not all need to be a stones throw from the politicians.

I like the high techiness (that's tecky, not techy, iyswim) of the idea and want to know if we can do it. Japan has had bullet trains for yonks.

Like your post about N Manc, iam.

KPMG done a report that said it will all be fantastic boost to the northern economy. How about getting on and boosting it now and not waiting over 10 years?

www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-24040674