Do we expect too much as a right in Great Britain?

A quick answer is that I don't think we expect too much. As a wealthy country we need to provide for all our citizens in health, welfare, education and housing. This 'right' was fought for by the working people of this country and passed by the government after WW2. In fact, the French revolutionaries called for all citizens to receive equal treatment in the 1790's so it is not such a new idea! The health care system has enabled the less able to access medical care, especially vaccinations for the health of our children e.g. polio vaccine for all this eventually wiping out the devastation that polio causes. In Kenya, the government has not been able to provide the population with this protection and as a result many children still die of the disease.
I've always been happy to pay whatever tax has been taken via the PAYE system to provide benefit and can only say that the care of this financing has not been my responsibility but that of successive governments. I can't say I've been particularly impressed by their performance! If our benefits needed more financing then I would have no doubt been ready to pay the extra needed. Our governments seem to have failed spectacularly in looking after the ordinary population especially in the light of the expenses scandals and various other nefarious activities that seem never ending .
Having lived in both Turkey and Republic of Ireland I can certainly vouch for the fact that although our systems are not perfect they provide the basics. A visit to the doctors in Rep Ireland cost £20 fifteen years ago and a minor knee operation in Turkey over £1000. The ordinary people in Turkey are expected to provide all meals to their sick relatives and general nursing care. On a visit to Australia it cost me £80 to visit the dentist and a similar amount to get a whooping cough vaccination because there was a new baby in our family and we needed to protect ourselves from passing it on.
I think it's an absolute scandal that public housing was sold off so that now my taxes go to pay private landlords housing benefit rather than be returned to the public purse. I'm sure the public finances could have been better managed but I don't believe that any private company runs a public business for the good of the nation. It runs a business for profit and so our taxes go to provide profit for business whilst their staff are poorly paid compared to the equivalent in the public service (if there are any left).
I think we are still fortunate in our public services and look forward to the day when our children's children may be able to get a university education that does not cost them a fortune, public services that are a service etc.
Our lives may not be perfect but I believe that everything possible should be done to maintain what we have left and put more effort into building services for all rather than the best for the few.

The United Kingdom is a very good place to live .
I am so very glad I am here and nowhere else !!

Well apart from the U.S of A of course

I like Merida, she is spunky.

DGD2 is Anna from 'Frozen' at the moment. She is spunky too.

Spirit of 45! A great film

To be fair, I do not think that a child having a 'lethal' weapon for a toy means it is going to be violent or tempted to violence when adult. DGD is very proud of her bow and arrow, she pretends to be Merida, the brave Scottish Princess.

DGS knight obsession is a result of watching the Horrible Historys, which both DGC love to distraction. It has given two children now aged 3 and 6 a very good grasp of British history and also chronology. Michael Gove really ought to put them in the primary school curriculum.

Thanks Eloethan, for your response to the long post from granjura.

I wonder if GrannyTwice has found any of the young people, expecting everything on a plate that Ninny refers to.

What a negative view of their fellow human beings some folks have. I don't dispute there are some young folks who don't live up to our expectations, but I'm certain sure lots of people of all ages can be judged and found wanting, if that's the approach to life that makes us happy.

The UK is a good place to live. The spirit of 1945 hasn't been completely beaten down and my own view is counting our blessings, rather than whinging on would be a Good Thing

I had at least one gun with caps when I was young (and I am female, so it wasn't just little boys who played with guns). I have not grown up and shot anyone (yet). We used to play cowboys and Indians and I don't think we grew up with murderous tendencies; however, I was not brought up in a country with a gun culture.
Some of the films and games available these days are far more violent.

Tiny children do think they are the centre of their parents' universe and it is only as they get a bit older they learn that the world does not necessarily revolve around them. I think it gives them confidence and they can be taught as they grow to cope with the world outside and realise it is not always kind.
(Not quite sure what this had to do with the original post, but perhaps I am a bit slow this evening. )

I am very thankful for treatment we have received from the NHS, at the same time as being aware of its failings.
I think we are fortunate to live in a country like Great Britain - even though our system is not perfect it is better than some others.

Knives and daggers certainly are though.

I wouldn't really encourage any sort of toy weapon but I can see your point.

I suppose the thing about guns is they are current weapons and we hear about horrible gun crimes quite often, whereas swords aren't generally used as weapons these days.

Just picked up the bit about guns. When my son was small I discouraged guns as toys, but capitulated over a pistol to go with his cowboy outfit. A local Dude ranch was a popular party venue and there was a lot more to it than shoot outs, but a cowboy without a gun is like Postman Pat without a cat.

Roll forward 35 years. DS has his own son, guns do not feature in his life or in any of the lives of little boys of his acquaintance. BUT they have all got swords. DGS is obsessed/fascinated by knights. Almost every member of the family has bought him a knights outfit for birthday or Christmas, he has a traditional knights outfit, helmet, chainmail t shirt - and sword, he has a Viking outfit, cavalier outfit, crusader outfit, Roman centurion outfit, all with the appropriate sword.

He is not alone on one visit to a castle he twice nearly got into armed combat with other children also waving swords. One afternoon he spent half an hour sitting on my lap holding a large plastic axe to my throat. He was a Viking and he was going to kill me.

What makes swords acceptable where guns aren't? It is still boys playing killing people - and each other.

This is my OP and I will catch up, but there are a lot of long posts and we have visitors. Back soon.

Agree about the gun- My friend did not write this btw- but only wanted to share on FB. I don't necessarily agree with every word- but do agree that kids are often over-indulged and over-protected these days- and that it does them a disfavour in the long-term.

Although I don't think children should be unduly indulged and their every whim catered for, in the main I don't agree with what was said by this mother. I also think this person is rather too certain of the rightness of her own ideas and I don't accept that there is a uniform "mindset" that modern parents have.

I don't understand what allowing a little boy to play with a toy gun has to do with the original premise. Personally, I would not buy a toy gun (or any sort of militaristic paraphenalia) for a boy or a girl. As to the "good guy/bad guy" scenario, I remember that the old westerns almost invariably portrayed the "good guy" as a white American cowboy and the "bad guy" as an Indian, which I think was a simplistic and damaging message.

It seems that the person who posted this item is from the USA and is using the issue of child rearing to sneak in several wider political points.

I have often said that I would willingly swop a whole range of pensioner benefits; prescriptions, tv licences, bus passes, winter fuel allowance etc for a higher basic pension that left me free to decide how I spend my money. I would ditch the free school lunches for all infant school children plan as well. But free lunches for children from poor and deprived homes, absolutely, breakfast clubs ditto, although many, if not all of these are paid for by charities, not the state.

Rather than justifying our benefits to the Australians, why not ask them why a wealthy country like theirs cannot ensure that poor children have enough nutrition to benefit from their education and universal pensions and a good free health service. The inequalities in the USA are even worse. I do not know the details of Obamacare but before it something like 15 million people in the US were without any medical care at all. I once saw a programme about a UK doctor running a free surgery in the USA for those without medical insurance. Among the patients was a young mother with 3 small children and terminal breast cancer for which she had not received any treatment because she could not afford it.

Our benefits are in line with those elsewhere in Europe. We should in general be proud of them. I do think that some could be pruned but when you see the mess that Ian Duncan-Smith is making of some of the changes; a seriously mentally ill man locally died of starvation because he was erroneously declared fit to work and he was too ill and isolated to cope with an appeal, I think we should stay as we are.

Thank you for posting that Granjura

CRIKEY, Phew , OHH my sweet Lord,

sorry I found that sad .

There is a cover for every pie !!

A young friend, with 2 young children, posted this on FaceBook today, and I can but agree:

Why My Kids Are NOT the Center of My World

Wait, what did she say? Yeah, you read that right.
This blog post is a bit of a rant and it’s a bit all over the place. My kids are NOT the center of my world, and that’s quite simply because they aren’t the center of any world, anywhere.

If you’re feeling adventurous today, feel free to read on. I’ll forewarn you though, this post contains subject matter about which I feel very strongly. As are most emotionally heated issues – I suppose it’s controversial. But hey, I feel how I feel and that’s not going to be changed.

The emotions that sparked this blog post were given a little bit of a supercharge last evening. Hendrix was picking out what he wanted to take to school for Show & Tell. He chose a little Imaginext action figure – one that he’s had for about two years now. With the action figure comes a little yellow object. For the two years that he’s had this toy, that yellow object has always been a drill to him. He gathered the action figure, the mask that goes with him, and the yellow drill and proudly told me he’d chosen that for Show & Tell. Then, you could see him thinking. And he promptly changed his mind and said to me, “You know what, I better not take this. My teacher will probably think it’s a gun, and then I’ll get in trouble,” put the action figure back, and chose something else.

I often think about the world my boys will grow up in. I often get angry when I think about it. This particular situation just furthered those emotions for me.

In completely selfish terms, bringing my boys into this world was such a great decision – for me. They bring me so much joy, they fill my heart, they make me happy. But I often question whether or not it was the right decision for them. My boys are typical little boys. They love to play guns. They love to play good guy versus bad guy. They love to wrestle and be rowdy. That’s the nature of little boys, as it has been since the beginning of time.

How long will it be before their typical boy-ish behavior gets them suspended from school? How long before they get suspended from daycare??? How long will it be before one of them gets upset with a friend, tells that friend to go away and leave them alone, and subsequently gets labeled as a bully?

The mentality of our society in 2013 is nauseating to me, friends.

Many years ago, there was a time where young boys could run around with their toy guns, killing the bad guys. You could take the toy guns away from the little boys, and they’d find something else around them – a stick, their fingers, etc – and pretend it was a gun. Today, those little boys – if caught doing that – are labeled as threats, and immediate action is taken to remove that threat from the group.

There was a time – not too long ago – when bullying was defined as slamming someone up against a locker and stealing their lunch money. There was a time when kids got called names and got picked on, and they brushed it off and worked through it (ask me how I know this). Now, if Sally calls Susie a bitch (please excuse my language if that offends you), Susie’s whole world crumbles around her, she contemplates suicide, and this society encourages her to feel like her world truly has ended, and she should feel entitled to a world-wide pity party. And Sally – phew! She should be jailed! She should be thrown in juvenile detention for acting like – gasp – a teenage girl acts.

Modern parenting and thinking makes me crazy. The young generations of today (yes, I sound old. I realize I’m only 29 years old.) are being taught that they shouldn’t have to ever put up with anything doesn’t make their hearts feel like rainbow colored unicorns are running around pooping skittles onto piles of marshmallows.

Modern parenting is creating a generation that’s not going to be able to function in society.

Your child, who you cater to every need, who you shelter from all things “evil.” How will this child react when he or she grows into adulthood? “Debbie” graduates from high school and goes to college. She writes her first paper and meets with her professor about that paper and the professor tells her that it’s junk and it will get a failing grade. How will Debbie cope with that if she’s always been made to feel that no one should ever make her feel sad, or criticize anything she does?

“Donna” graduates from college and gets a job – you know, in the real world. She has to work on a committee to come up with a marketing plan. She shoots out an idea, and it gets immediately turned down. What is she to do? Go home and cry because no one liked her idea? Quit her job because she can’t handle rejection?

Modern parents, who drop everything all the time to sit and play with the child, who “needs attention,” or drop what they’re doing to help the child the second he or she gets frustrated? How is Joey going to deal with the fact that there won’t be anyone in his adult life who’s willing to stop what they’re doing, stop living their busy lives, to cater to his every whim?

How do you think Billy is going to cope in the real world, when his boss gives him a vague task to complete, and offers no helpful information as to how to complete this task? Mr. Boss is certainly not going to hold Billy’s hand and help him through the task. Mr. Boss expects it to be completed by Monday. How has Billy been prepared to use his critical thinking and problem solving skills to be able to complete that task? He hasn’t.

I certainly hope that the title of this blog post is starting to make sense. Parents who make their children the center of their universe are not doing anyone any favors. Obviously, as parents, we love our children more than anything. But dropping everything to cater to their every need is only going to lead to a very rude awakening once they enter the real world.

I’m not telling anyone how to parent, and I’m far from perfect myself. But when my kids can’t find something, I refuse to help them until they’ve at least made a concerted effort to find it themselves. This isn’t being mean, it’s teaching them to at least attempt to solve a problem themselves before just giving up and asking for help.

When the TV gets turned off after the allotted time on the weekends, my kids are instructed to go play together in their room. I love and miss them during the work week, but I am not just a mom, I’m also Matt’s wife, I’m also Stephanie, and I also run our household. There are things I have to get done, and my boys understand that. My children – while Matt and I both spend time playing with them – understand that the world doesn’t begin and end with them. This allows them to find ways to entertain themselves, it builds imagination, and it teaches them to get along with each other without constant intervention.

We follow the rules and don’t take toy guns or weapons to daycare. But I’ll be darned if my boys aren’t allowed to be little boys when they’re at home. They have several toy guns and it’s constantly a good guy vs. bad guy battle in my house. I feel like this teaches them to do the things they want to do, while respecting other’s rules and regulations. It also teaches them that there are differing opinions about things in this world and that’s ok. We can like and believe in the things we want, while respecting that others may not agree with us.

My children are all but ignored when they ask for something without using manners. They understand that when someone addresses or speaks to them, they are to speak back. When we go out to eat, we don’t take 5 electronic devices to keep them “entertained” for the 15 minutes we have to wait for our food. If Hendrix is “bored” (and I use that term loosely), then he can put on his jacket and go play outside.

Everyone parents differently, and I respect that. The current generation may be one that expects nothing less than everything from this world. But I know of two gentlemen that are going to be able to accept failure and move on having learned something from it.

I know of two gentleman who will be hurt emotionally, but who will be able to work through the hurt and carry on with life. I will cushion the emotional fall as much as a mom can, but I will not completely prevent it from happening. They will not expect whoever hurt them to be punished. Heck, I might even teach my children the power of forgiveness.

These two gentlemen will understand the value of hard work, and know that hard work is required to get where one wants to be in life.

They will, while understanding the need for caution, appreciate that not everyone out there is out to get them. Not everyone is out to do evil things.

These gentlemen will understand that there are about a gazillion people in this world. While they are incredibly special to me and my family, they are not special to the world. That probably sounds terrible, but people! It’s the harsh truth, and it needs embraced!

I know that I can’t change the mindset of modern parents. That’s never been and never will be my goal. I just want to make sure that I raise my sons to grow into respectable men who can thrive and succeed, due to having been prepared to do so.

My kids are not the center of my world because I love them enough not to allow them to be.

Have a great weekend, friends.

Why shouldn't the younger generation think they can 'have it all'
After all, they were brought up/ educated by a government that told them they could have it all.
And why should they think that's its wrong for them to 'want it all' when they see what's going on in the government / police / NHS.
If our 'leaders' act like pigs at a trough, why shouldn't they. Not saying it's right, just looking with their eyes.

Ariadne it's good to be able to agree with yourself, I might try it!

GrannyTwice have you just popped over from Mumsnet, what granny doesn't want to retire in her 60's to help look after her grandchildren if required. Or perhaps you are an Alto Ego is the clue in your name!

That wasn't my point, though, Penstemmon. The people who complained loudest were not members of the privileged middle-classes whose own children were doing fine, but lower-paid workers and those struggling on benefits themselves.

I was responding to Eleothian's last paragraph, not commenting on the tv programme itself.

You think there was no other streets that would have provided the same 'entertainment'?

I expect that street was carefully chosen because it was unusual in that it contained enough 'stories' to make a programme rather than being a typical mix of 'hardworking ordinary people', those fallen on hard times and those avoiding making a positive contribution.!

I'm not sure your last paragraph is wholly correct, Eleothan. Apparently the largest group voicing their anger and disbelief at the amount of benefits some of the partipants of the Benefits Street documentary series comprised those on low pay or benefits themselves.

If I really missed living somewhere, I think I would be prepared to forego a better standard of living for the comfort of feeling "at home".

I'm sure there are all sorts of places where the cost of living is much cheaper than in the UK, but where you feel happy is not just about how much the cost of living is - though, of course, it's very miserable to be poor anywhere especially if everyone else seems to be comfortably off.

I suspect that those who are quite happy with a pared down welfare state are those who have enough money to pay for the essentials (decent housing, health care, food, energy, etc.) for themselves and their families and who are unwilling to pay taxes to fund these essentials for others.