Do we expect too much as a right in Great Britain?

Good luck with this thread, rosequartz!

ha ana! I must say that we had a chat over dinner and from what they have noticed and read since arriving they are flabbergasted somewhat surprised by what life is like here. Perhaps we need people from overseas to make us realise just how lucky we are.

Not 'Should we', as much as 'Will have to'. C'est la vie.

Just for you, rose. Your NHS isn't as bad as you are told.
www.opendemocracy.net/node/81624

Personally, fingers crossed, I have found the NHS in Wales very good, but have heard that there is a lack of funding, less than that in the rest of GB.

Otherwise, I can only go on what I have heard from other people's experiences nationwide. (Personal reports, not the media I should add, before I get accused of reading the DM.)

rosequart. Other people's experiences are often much more reliable than media reports (of whatever type) anyway.

The opendemocracy link is to a Nuffield Trust report, which is usually on the government's side. As you say, rose, better results from less funding.

I do know that people wait much longer for knee, hip replacements in Wales than just across the border in England.

However, the OP is really - are we expecting too much State help in comparison with other first-world countries?

I don't think we expect too much - considering the amount of taxes we pay.

Which countries' citizens would be astonished? And what are they astonished at?

Most other developed countries have similar social systems to ours.

My Aussie colleagues tell me that in their public hospitals there is a statutory maximum number of patients that a ward nurse can be responsible for ..... it's something like 4!!

I'm astonished at that.

I did mention in the OP they are from Australia.

No school meals, let alone free ones.
No state pension if you have a private one.
Taxes are higher than ours.
On top of that they have to pay Medicare or into a private scheme.

And surely the USA is less generous than the UK?

I am beginning to wonder if we take too much for granted in this country.

I was referring to:

'There are many other benefits available which would astonish citizens of many other countries. '

River, talking about the amount of taxes we pay, what do you think of this?
www.theguardian.com/politics/2014/apr/18/hmrc-to-sell-taxpayers-data
I expect HMRC not to sell my tax information. The government has obviously forgotten about care.data.
Apparently they have already sold VAT registration data to Experian, etc.

Maybe it's not a bad idea to have tax returns made public ..... we might get to see what the avoiders/evaders are up to!

This thread is going exactly the way I thought it would...

Off-piste Ana

I just asked the question out of interest having listened to our Australian visitors' views on Britain.

As I am feeling a little off-piste myself I will bid you

I'd like it if that was what it meant, River, but I do not think it does.
Apparently David Davies, Tory MP, calls the idea borderline insane.
They are actually going to anonymise the data.

Rose, do your friends know what the pay gap is in companies in Australia? Is it a more equal society compared to here? And does that include Aborigines? It would be interesting to know.

Rose, if you read the Opendemocracy report it says that waiting times for knee and hip replacements are not necessarily longer. In England we collect the data differently from Wales. Your cancer treatment is better.

Rose my posts were not off-piste - I directly addressed your OP, then directly answered durhamjen's question to me.

If you do not want us to discuss politics, you should not post on the politics thread.
I thought I was being very restrained and apolitical, mentioning the Nuffield Trust. It's a private health company, which I completely disagree with normally. The Welsh NHS is mentioned in the OP, but I am not supposed to comment on it?

I think we are going to have to become less dependent on the state in the near future. A lot of people already are.

It would be interesting to know about pensions.
The pension age has changed quite drastically here for women. What is it like in Australia?
What are the tax rates that are paid towards pensions?

I know nothing about Australia, but close friends from the USA are deeply envious of the NHS and the way we don't have to worry about affording surgery or other treatments. They pay a vast amount in private insurance and my friend who was head of nursing at the University of Virginia tells me that there is a tendency to over treat and huge inequalities.

Obviously our taxes are higher, but that is the fairest way of ensuring the health of the nation.

In the same way the provision of free school meals will assist in keeping children healthy and probably be a money saver in the long term.

Paying taxes and receiving health care and so on according to need isn't dependency. It's a mark of a society which has decided to use its resources wisely for the common good.

That's not to say that there are no inefficiencies in the systems or that, as ever, there will be a small minority who abuse those systems, but as a marker of a civilised nation I think that our system is a pretty good one.

The Australian health care system is very fragmented. If you need tests you have to run around town going to different providers. This is where NHS England is headed, and very rapidly too.
Also there is no free dentistry for children and dentists charge and extortionate amount for treatment. Life expectancy for aboriginal populations is 20 years less than other groups.
There is far less money given to schools, parents have to pay for all notebooks etc and PTAs are constantly trying to make money in what seems to be a rather unpleasant way e.g. its mother's day so you must bring money to school to buy a present from our stall. I think head teachers are afraid to upset their PTAs so they get away with some strong arm tactics.

South Africans are envious too for the same reasons you give Mice Elf 're health care.

On another note, I quite often have to correct misperceptions on the part of friends and family in various parts off the world, about the level of support that everyone gets here, "for free". There are a lot of myths out there about the welfare state.