Scotland YES or NO

I just wish I could see chapter and verse for these atrocities - or time, place and witnesses! I suspect we would find out that a few supporters, probably well bevvied up, saw an excuse to create mayhem. Much as some football supporters go to an away match and don't even bother watching it but just stay in the pub knocking it back and then go and put the head in to someone wearing a scarf in the wrong colours. That applies to both sidew, by the way.

Come on, Jane, tell us where this happened, and when. Has it been reported to the police?

A reminder to everyone - it is a SECRET BALLOT. If you want to openly support one side or the other, that is up to you, but you can also just turn up at the polling station and make your cross in private.

I think Marelli and Elegran have said it all. They speak with an authority hard to fault.

Remember anyone can say anything and even make up things. Without evidence it's only hearsay. So yes, if you simply take everything as gospel without passing through a bullshit reality checker I'd say you are either a very kind and trusting person or very gullible ... or perhaps both go hand in hand. Peace.

Don't worry Aka I'm certainly not worried about anyone like you.

Maybe we could be doing with a 'Peace' emoticon. For the next wee while, anyway!

What a nasty reply Niggly especially if you had read my reply, which certainly didn't warrant your rudeness. I won't descend to your level and reply in kind.

Perhaps I object to being called gullible, that was pretty rude too! I don't see how you know how Jane does or doesn't feel. I think she was was just pointing out that not all Scots are aggressive and anti English. Having had some lovely holidays in the highlands, admittedly a long time ago, I was only too happy to agree with the point she was making.

I'm not going to enter into discussion with you niggly

We in Scotland do not hate the English any more than the English hate the Scots. This is a political matter, not a personal one. There is absolutely no need for anyone to be terrified about either the process or the result.

On polling day, Scots will go to their polling station and vote for whether they would prefer to be in the Union or separate. It is a momentous and important decision, but it is not a reason for anyone to threaten anyone else, physiclly or verbally. It is not a reason, either, for anyone to go on as though they expect a bomb to be lobbed through their front door at any moment.

I had decided to ignore this thread now that there is some unpleasantness creeping in, but I do want to support Marelli, Aka and Elegran. Where is all this vandalism happening? It is being seriously under-reported if it is happening. I have just come home from a meeting where 2 of my friends who are No voters were present and we are still on friendly terms (shock, horror, hold the front page).

A while ago there was a post about Jim Murphy who was said to have been pelted with eggs wherever he went. In fact, a man who was annoyed that Mr Murphy wouldn't answer his question went to Tesco's and bought half a dozen eggs. He missed with 3 of them, then went up close and landed one on Mr Murphy's back. He has been sentenced to community service and has apologised. He wasn't even a Yes supporter. This is how stories get blown up and Aka's comments about detectors come into play.

Please let's keep a sense of proportion here.

Where did this happen jane? I have been following media coverage and there is no mention of the hell you describe.

There is nothing hellish going on here. I have been to a couple of meetings, all very civilised, friends who are voting yes, some voting no. After the first meeting a few of us, of differing views, went back to,a friends house for a glass of wine and more blethering.

You only have look at some of the Nationalist supporter to see that they look a pretty threatening crowd and I certainly wouldn't want them living near me.

So, will that be me, a life long Nationalist you are talking about? Or some of the other little, old ladies, mums with babies, pacifists, Greens and respected, long serving MSPs, MP,s and Councillors, etc. etc who are part of the YES movement. Can you tell me where you saw and were threatened by a crowd of us? Have you reported the incident(s). As far as I am aware no YES supporters have been arrested or charged with any offences whatsoever. Indeed the Chief of Police has congratulated campaigners on the good natured way in which the campaign has been conducted and stated that there has been less trouble throughout than there is after the average football match. Do you know that one of the 100+ groups affiliated to the Yes campaign is 'Celtic and Rangers Supporters for Independence'? Perhaps you would have to live in the West of Scotland to appreciate what an extraordinary 'coming together in common cause' that group is.

I am particularly proud that the whole grassroots referendum campaign has been conducted in a friendly, conversational way - jaw jaw not war war - and very frustrated that the MSM delight it trying to portray it as a bitter fight. Just this evening I was sent a picture of two semis, one plastered in YES posters, the other covered in NO ones. The biggest sign of all though, placed between the two homes was one which read - " Not just neighbours, but also best friends" -says it all really.

I live in Central Scotland and have not heard of any incidents of vandalism or violence connected with the referendum. Among my friends, family and former colleagues there are mixed opinions as is to be expected but they all manage to be perfectly civil to one another.

I know absolutely nobody who hates the English. I'm sure this type of bigotry exists but it is a tiny minority of people with equally tiny minds.

There was one egg-throwing incident - which has been reported in every paper and online news site you can think of.

"a Survation poll earlier this year, . . . . discovered that 21% of Yes voters have suffered abuse, either online or face-to-face, because of their opinions on independence. The equivalent figure for No voters was just 8%."

https://uk.news.yahoo.com/scottish-independence-yes-mob-rage-abuse-exaggerated-british-154934326.html#Ed6XvNF

I also live in Central Scotland,haven't heard of a single bit of trouble or vandalism,I will vote YES,some of my friends are NO voters,we will still be friends regardless of the outcome,I also do not hate the English,a whole lot of nonsense being brought into this now.

And, Baubles, tiny minds exist in all parts of the UK, and have all shades of opinions.

This referendum is certainly exciting some heat and hot air, but there is a lot of exaggeration in the press and in rumours, about how much, and about who is saying and doing what to whom.

Is there anyone on here who hasn't suffered abuse online?
It's usually the local papers where that happens, usually the trolls who have nothing better to do. The same people could be abusing the yes and no voters, just to see what reaction they get.

Hollydaze, you are being selective.
I said Gordon Brown can obviously be trusted by the Scottish people more than Cameron and Clegg.
He was giving the speech on behalf of all the no vote, not just himself, and his party, and in fact he is still trusted by many Scots.

By the way, Hollydaze, Gordon Brown does not need to reignite his political career. He is a UN Special Adviser on Global Education, and on the World Economic Forum. That's quite political.
Talking about pensions, are you aware that he is the only previous PM who has not taken his pension? I am sure Tony Blair needs his.

Here's an interesting article about what the Scottish people are being promised if they vote No.
www.politics.co.uk/comment-analysis/2014/09/05/is-westminster-lying-about-giving-scots-more-power

What a pitiful sideshow on the world stage this Scottish business is becoming. A shambolic and discredited gaggle of Westminster political incompetents kow-towing to a virulent anti-UK rabble of Scottish fanatics fired up on petty nationalism and false promises, with the media, as ever, fanning the flames of disillusion and discontent. Meanwhile, in the real world where there are many serious challenges to face, the UK leadership is running scared of its own future having failed all of its people. Dismantling the UK will not solve its problems, only fragment the fabric of society even more. Bad will become worse. And being English I don't even have a vote in this orgy of self-destruction.

Well said papaoscar. I agree with you and feel full of foreboding whichever way the referendum goes. Why is Tony Blair so conspicuously absent from the furore? He started all this!

Not well said at all. Full of emotive and inaccurate rhetoric such as 'a virulent anti-UK rabble of Scottish fanatics' and prophesies of doom. Get a grip Papaoscar and try to calm down.

Let there be peace among us - let there be love in our eyes to all who are feeling aggrieved at this moment in time .

Aka at risk of drawing your fire can I just say that many people do agree with papaoscar whether you like it or not. There is great cause for concern for us all, whatever the result.

I'm not about to gun you down Gaga but I was simply pointing out that papaoscar's post was full of inaccurate rhetoric. I even gave an example.

If you believe him when he says the Scots who want to exercise their privilege to vote YES are 'a virulent anti-UK rabble of Scottish fanatics fired up on petty nationalism and false promises' then that is your right.

Personally I don't recognise Marelli or Granny23 or others from that description. Do you?