What would you like to see cut?

It has happened down the centuries hasnt it. People migrating to Australia, Canada, New Zealand, the Far East.

It might end up that many people lose their jobs in order to make the books balance.
And many people leave the country. A brain drain.

To cut % spending to the pre-war level is to completely obliterate the Welfare State in which we have all grown up and some of us grown old. We once set an example which much of the world (except the USA) aspired to copy. This is shameful. Nye Bevan et al must be rotating in their graves.

Well you succeeded in getting us going whitewave

I am glad that this government has got rid of some anomalies. Mr Osborne has said the personal tax allowance will go up to £10,600 next year. If he actually makes that £10,660 he will have aligned all working and pension age tax allowances I think.

Simple things like this must save money on administration.

Do you have any ideas how to make it impossible for companies such as the Ritz to avoid paying their taxes GillT57. I do realise my idea of cutting all tax relief measures would not be possible in one fell swoop but they need to be hacked down where possible surely?

Where 5% and 50% are being discussed the common figure coming up on the news and political programmes appear to be that we have cut 40% of what is necessary so 60% to go. Even the news channels seem to be taking that as a fact and not challenging it. I have heard a couple of Conservatives say that everyone said things would fall apart when they made the earlier cuts and look ... it hasn't happened. Stupid people! Currently, many services are surviving on the goodwill of those working in them. The scarcity principle means that the money they have is filling short-term gaps and often being wasted where more, for a period of time, might help them take long-term money saving measures. Add to that the thought that many businesses often survive until they collapse so completely they cannot be saved and yes, I see them as stupid.

I wonder if their scaremongering has backfired? Maybe the suggestion of massive cuts and return to pre-war austerity was a ruse to make us all grateful when the cuts are only say 20%. If as a government they make worrying if not terrifying statements like Osborne did yesterday they have to take the questioning that comes along.

I see that questioning the possibility of where these cuts are going to come from is now bringing a charge of hyperbole by the government to the BBC, seems to me that they are trying to close down debate on the subject.

gracegran and everyone, - If you read my post I originally suggested that you need not accept the original argument for cuts. I was simply playing devil's advocate and putting the governments case.

I will come clean and say that what GO is suggesting is so outrageous that it is beyond comprehension. I would defy anybody to come up with a plan to achieve what he is suggesting.

What he is suggesting is that our annual public expenditure should be 35% of GDP which is less than any other developed country in the world, and exactly the same % as in the 1930's. The man is a lunatic.

In reality, the general public dont know anywhere near enough about how all or most of the departments operate to be able to come up with a good guess answer.

I see several posters have mentioned 5% cuts, or "5% across the board." Can I refer you back to the OP, which mentioned 50%? In fact, going from £3000 to £1300 would take more than a 50% cut.

No wonder the owners of The Ritz could be so generous in their hospitality of the sainted Mrs T in her twilight years eh? In exchange for them paying their Corporation Tax I am sure we as a country could have managed to pay for her to stay in a warden controlled flat with 3 visits from harassed, underpaid carers 3 times a day, being fed reheated pap. Slightly off topic I know, sorry. Still, at least I can stick to my principles, I cant afford to visit The Ritz!. I do my bit though, I dont shop in Arcadia shops, dont use Vodaphone, dont use Tesco, shop locally mainly. But back to the point of the original post, The HS2 project is an absolute nonsense vanity project, and I have listened to many a discussion about it on Radio 4 and remain unconvinced of the arguments for it. I understand that cities and regions outside the M25 area need cross rail and inter city connections to be improved, and all for it, but do think that all HS2 will do is put the commuter ring even further out. We already have people travelling on a daily basis from Peterborough, Northampton and such places to work in London in a desperate attempt to afford a home, all this HS2 will do is extend that commuter belt. The money earmarked would be better spent on improving local lines all over the UK and improving broadband connections.

Trident.

I have said this before and will say it again; I have a small business, employ 8 people part time and I pay more Corporation Tax than The Ritz Hotel

Yes me too GillT57 it makes me sick.

Yes Gracesgran* why must we believe that we are being told the truth about necessary cuts? And why is everyone so calmly accepting of it? To use a simple comparison: in a household we have income and certain outgoings. If there is a negative balance at the end of the month we have two options: reduce outgoings or increase income. Certain economies can be made in such things as food, fuel, clothing, but other expenses are inflexible i.e council tax, water, power, rent/mortgage. in that situation we would look at increasing income by taking on more hours/better paid job/second job. To apply this simple analogy to central government, they have now cut all they can on expenditure, now need to increase income so to my mind they need to start aggressive tax collection from individuals and those who shelter their companies in tax havens. I have said this before and will say it again; I have a small business, employ 8 people part time and I pay more Corporation Tax than The Ritz Hotel. So, sorry Whitewave it is not all about cuts to expenditure it is also about increasing income. Given a spread sheet I bet most of us here could do a better job than those responsible now. And Papaoscar I agree wholeheartedly with your comments about the top brass who serve no purpose other than ceremonial. We could pay for 5 or 6 teachers for what each of those pompous old farts gentlemen cost us

Instead of fuddling about with 5% cuts to all the budgets, where any saving made will be cancelled out by the cost of planning and implementing the cuts, there needs to be drastic changes and cancellations of 'vanity' projects. I mean H62, renewal of trident, new motorways etc. I would also abolish the House of Lords, forthwith, or at least suspend it for the duration of the economic crisis.

We live on a very tight budget and there is no excess spending on anything. We have the cheapest deals for fuel, computer, insurance, etc and have cut our food bill to the bone - although it still rises as prices creep up continuously whilst our income is fixed. Today we have had to cancel plans to surface our driveway (needed but not essential) because we are facing a £1,000+ repair bill for the car - which is essential.

The government must bite the bullet and cancel or delay these huge projects. They must become our 'Jam tomorrow' so that we can have our daily bread now.

I would like to respond to two posts.

GillT57 I agree with the scrapping of the HS2 project that will predominately serve the South of England (as usual) and will no doubt run into £ billions. I am not convinced that saving a few minutes on a journey will make one iota of difference as to whether a contract is won or lost. I totally agree with the Pay or Go taxation system. How dare the likes of Gary Barlow claim to be charitable when he is guilty of tax avoidence. Hypocrite of the highest order.

papaoscar yes in an ideal world all employers should pay a "living wage" (although not sure how this could be defined) but please bear in mind that once manufacturers are pushed into paying higher wages for the most menial of tasks then three things are inevitable.
1) Manufacturers will leave the uk.
2) Companies will automate all possible processes.
3) The cost of everything we buy will rise steeply to cover the additional costs.

Whose lives are going to be turned upside down, Gracesgran. Will anyone's life be dramatically different after whatever it is you're envisaging happens?

I have to agree GillT57 that, IMO, the tide turned when Madame T was in power. The attempt was to make everyone believe they were all middle-class now and therefore had more in common with those who espoused completely free markets rather than the truth, which is that most live on income not capital and tend to get our little bit of savings or capital investment gobbled up by big capitalists, This led many into taking on and then living on, personal debt. (I could talk about her grasping power to the centre too but this is not what we are about in this thread).

Whitewave you seem to have swallowed the conservative propaganda that it is all about cuts. Of course the Conservatives want us to believe this is all about cuts as their aim is and always has been for smaller government and the awful mess brought about by free market capitalists is giving them every opportunity to convince us that this must happen. They will, of course, destroy many people in the process as they care little about the low wage economy they are creating.

Yes, of course we need to make some cuts but we must invest in growing the economy too. Investment in the infrastructure and education are hugely important.

I would, in order to help toward the cuts that are actually necessary cut all tax relief measures. Absolutely all. Everyone should pay their tax.

With the Conservatives saying that only 40% of the "necessary" cuts have been made my brain is unable to think of more. I just want to weep for the poor people who are going to have their lives turned upside-down.

Employers should be required to pay a living wage without the state having to top-up pay. Rents should be controlled so as to reduce public support. Squadrons and regiments of useless gold-braided military brass-hats should be put out to grass, together with cohorts of parasitic NHS senior management. This should all provide loads of savings. I would also set up a proper analysis and costing of the nations needs. I would also start the claw back, without compensation, of national assets, infrastructure and utilities. And I haven't started on Westminster or the Monarchy yet. I would be a real Genghis Khan!

I cant decided if the HS2 rail line is nonsense or not.

What do I need to google to find some articles about this?

As to what I would like to see cut, if cuts are needed:
Scrap Trident
scrap the nonsense HS2 rail line
Public scrutiny ( not MPs, real people in real companies) of spending on IT systems. ( Just how much was wasted on the NHS system?)
Pay or Go system of taxation; either pay your taxes or bugger clear off, this is to be applied to tax dodging companies and individuals. We dont only need to cut spending, we need to increase income. Name and shame them. If they dont pay their way, dont shop in their shops ( Phillip Green of Arcadia group take note), dont buy their music, dont go to their concerts.

soon no I am not big chief but trying to work out how these massive cuts are to be made and nothing that the GN's have suggested so far will any where near get to the goal. We need to think a massive amount not bits and pieces around the edge.

I keep swithering between fear of the future and fury at the country being in this mess. To my mind, and I know many will disagree, the rot started with Margaret Thatcher and her policies. She was able to keep everyone happy by selling off lots of the 'family silver' to subsidise spending, and I truly believe that selling off council owned homes without using the receipts to build replacements is the basis of a lot of the problems. We now have the situation when even people on what would once have been considered a fair income are unable to pay their way, pay their rent without some form of tax credit or housing benefit. I am not criticising the people concerned, but think it is a dreadful situation when people are often receiving more in tax credits than they do from their employer. I also am not necessarily criticising the employer. In my own family, when my parents and their siblings got married, they all paid their own way, uncles who were lorry drivers, police constables, were able to not only pay their own rent, but could save up and have a good holiday every year. I dont know what the answer is, but I have a good suspicion on what the cause is. I fear for both my retirement, if it should ever happen, and for the future of my children. They will both be professional graduates and unlikely to be able to be able to rent a decent property let alone own their own.

What do you mean, soontobe?

Letters from gov. depts. about things i already know! They have my e mail, so use that!

It is interesting that some things are on the internet, are in the "public domain", so we have to find out for ourselves. Brings to mind the saying, 'if you want to keep a secret, post it on a notice board.'

But other things, such as the winter fuel allowance require a personal letter?

Such a waste. x