Eleven Plus Exam

I feel for the children that will be 'hot housed' for eighteen months to get them through the exam. I think it's possible that one or two of them who pass may then struggle at their senior school as they weren't really at the level needed.
Maybe you ex-teachers will tell me this isn't likely.

petallus We had a similar scenario when my 2 eldest DGSs took the exam for a well known boys college,it was not the 11+ but boys could apply with the recommendation of their Headmaster at their Junior School,there was some questioning amongst parents as to why their son's where not put forward by the School and I think some applied independantly,our two boys where fortunate enough to both win places with all fee's paid but DD did not have them do any extra tutition as she said if they have the ability they will get in anyway,many of the boys failed even given that they where tutoured and I am of a firm opinion that these boys where living their parents wishes not their own and they where under such pressure
Both my boys have had a wonderful education from this College with one working as an engineer at Land Rover on special projects and the other chap in his 2nd year in a Law Firm in Liverpool,he did have a year out after a bit of wobble but soon got back on track.
I think if parents can't afford extra tutition as long as they give their children 100% support they can't go wrong.

I think some of those who are hot housed just to pass a test may well fail, or struggle, and that is sad. Much better for a child to see learning as enjoyable, in an environment which suits them and gives them opportunities to succeed in a variety of areas. (I will not get started on grammar schools again! I was an assistant head in a big comprehensive school, and loved it)

I sat(and passed) the 11+ in 1972. We were working class from a council estate. You either sat it and passed or you didn't. No extra tuition. My parents wouldn't have been able to afford it anyway.

I don't feel for the children who are "hot housed" at all. I feel for the children who's parents are not in the position to pay.

gilly there's absolutely no reason to stealthily remind us that you're so very young!

I also passed the 11+ but this was in the 50's. Nobody in those days was tutored, I doubt if parents could afford it and it did not happen. The carrot for me was a new bike, I had a second hand one, but I had to get an A grade. The bike won, I chose a green Raleigh!

I do feel for children that are hot housed. It can be an awful thing.

And for the children whose parents cant pay. There will be children in that group who, if they were on a level playing field, would have got in.

I had a grammar school education. It was very beneficial.

If I was a parent in that county, if I thought my child was borderline for getting in, I would get a tutor for say a couple of subjects if I could afford it. Even if I had to cut down on even some basics.

It is said that comprehensives in areas where there are grammar schools are usually not that good, the brightest pupils having been creamed off and more funding going to the grammar school.

That may or may not be true.

DD said she thought she might tutor GS herself. Has anybody heard of that?

It's quite possible to tutor your own child if you have the time, the knowledge and the ability. I haven't looked on the internet but I bet there are books available to take you through it.

This is all wrong, though, isn't it? In an ideal world our comprehensives would be hothouses of excellence (sorry, that sounds like M Gove!) Of course, they are not, so those who can afford it will make different arrangements for their children and it was ever thus. The ones I feel most sorry for are the bright kids from poor families who have little famlly support and cannot afford hot-housing and so drift off to the local comp where they under-achieve.

We shouldn't forget, though, that it is possible to gain good qualifications after leaving school if one has motivation and determination. I speak as one who left grammar school with two miserable GCEs but managed to get a degree and several post-grad qualifications as well as two children and four grandchildren along the way. Sorry - not a boast, just pointing out that it can be done.

In Scotland in the 50s, we had an exam that determined which stream we would be allocated to. A-stream pupils had Latin which I enjoyed. My Dad tried to interest me in maths, without much success. I coached my dyslexic GD in GCSE English which she managed to pass, much to my relief. This enabled her to achieve University entrance to study a subject of interest to her - not English! Two of my GC are being tutored in maths because my DS is dissatisfied with the school's teaching of the subject. And frankly, I think their teaching of literacy is also suspect but luckily they are both good readers and can do their own thing at home.

My DH was also offered a bike if he passed the 11+. He passed the exam but never got the bike; it rankles with him to this day. I failed mine. I was hopeless at number subjects. The boy next door to us passed his. My mother was deeply upset for a while, I suppose because I was considered to be bright child in most subjects, but neither my mother or my father, by virtue of their own relative lack of education, ever thought they ought encourage me with my school work, as opposed to the BND, whose parents did, and quite right too. I agree that 'hot housing' children to pass exams is not a good thing, for the reasons stated in previous posts, but if a child is struggling with a particular subject, coaching can be beneficial if the parents are in a position to pay for it and if it would assist his or her education in general. I never felt I was particularly disadvantaged by my secondary school education. I have had good interesting jobs and travelled with them, and my cousin, who also failed his 11+ and went to the same school as me is now a retired college lecturer and was, at one point in his career, part of the British Antarctic Survey Team.

I was promised allsorts of rewards for passing my 11+ Greyduster and like your DH most of mine never materialised. A normally particularly mean uncle did buy me the latest Donny Osmond album as a reward though.

To be honest I was a little disappointed when I passed. Most of my friends didn't and I was the only one in my circle of friends going to the girls grammar school.

All in all I am not in favour of grammar schools.

My parents never asked about or assisted with homework. They certainly never gave me any incentive of any kind to pass my 11+ which I didn't by the way.
I agree you don't have to have been to grammar school to be an achiever. My class mate from Secondary Modern School is a very respected deputy head.

I wouldn't rush to get children tutored for an exam, unless it is down to pure nerves. They will only end up somewhere they shouldn't be. DBH used to do maths tutoring, but only to explain things more slowly if they kept getting stuck in a certain area and actually wanted to be tutored. He always did an exploratory session first, to see where weaknesses lay. Sometimes they just needed a confidence boost. Usually, actually.

It is the tutored children who are more likely to end up somewhere they should not be, not the untutored.

My 16 year old GS attends a grammar school. His friends seem to be from wealthy families and quite a few attended fee paying primary schools which catered specifically for the 11 plus exam.

Only 2 per cent of children who attend grammar schools are eligible for school meals compared with 7 per cent national average.

No such thing as a comprehensive in an area where there are grammar schools or the 11+.

Is it still secondary modern?

DH made the DGCs laugh when he told them his dad promised him a bike if he passed the 11+. He did and his dad bought him the bike then used it to go to work every day.

I had to make a whole lot of new friends when I failed my 11 plus. All my old friends passed and went to the grammar school. I was really upset if I met any of them outside school, as none of them ever spoke to me again. I often wonder what became of them and if any of them ended up with as satisfying a career as I have had in Mental Health Nursing.

It's not called secondary modern any more, but it is. It cannot possibly be comprehensive when the most academic students have been creamed off the top.

My grandparents said they'd buy me a Parker pen if I passed the 11+. I don't think they understood why I wasn't over the moon about their generous offer, although I tried to look thrilled...

I don't remember whether I actually got one or not!

I must have been a borderline fail, because I got a second chance on the grounds that my parents had just divorced. I don't recall having any real idea what it was, or what it meant at the time. My grammar school went comprehensive the year after I started anyway. At about that time the headmaster wanted to nominate me for the scholarship at the local boarding school but I begged my dad not to let him, "What's the point of having a home if you have to live at school?".

Come to think of it, I don't think I had any idea of the difference between university and college, or O levels and A levels, I just wanted out of school at the first opportunity.

There was an article in the papers recently, can't remember which one, that said that much tutoring is counterproductive. Children who have not received coaching and approach the exam in a more relaxed manner do better in these tests than children who come home from school tired, to face at least an hour of coaching and a lot of parental pressure to do well and who then approach the exam in a stressed and fearful manner.

Both my children did entrance exams for schools with competitive entrance procedures. They had no coaching beyond me buying a book of sample test papers so they knew what to expect. My feeling was that if they got places at these schools it would be because they were genuinely up to the standard expected. I was concerned that coaching might get them into a school where they would then struggle because they were not naturally up to the standard expected.

I was a borderline fail too. My parents decided not to let me retake as I would have lost all my friends which, as an only child in a small village, they thought was an important consideration. Socially it was the right decision. Academically it was a failure since girls didn't do maths or science in the sec mod school. Not that I'd have been any good at either it did grate that even the dimmest boys were being taught exciting chemistry. Girls did business arithmetic and human biology.

I can understand why parents pay for extra tuition. Nobody wants their child to be a failure. And then there's the kudos and parental pride - but hopefully nowadays those who do fail the 11+ get just as good an education and late developers don't loose out. Hopefully.