Terror attacks in France and Tunisia/now

That's all very well, POGS but can you imagine the reaction if a white man had shouted, 'What's that black woman doing here?'

The shootings in America, in church were a matter of race, Muslim terrorists/extremists do it all in the name of religion and feel justified in killing not only non Muslims but Muslims of a different sect.They aim to take over as much territory as they can while they are doing this and impose their own twisted deadly version of Islam on the population.

POGS I think you did exactly the right thing in awkward circumstances for the Diwali party. it sounds as if the old man was well known for saying whatever popped into his head.

Old folk are like that - say the first thing that pops into my their head.

and then live to regret it.

My late MiL was a terrible one for saying exactly what popped into her head without thought to anyone's feelings. I remember her asking some parents what their little boy was called. When they replied 'Xavier' she came out with 'Xaviour? What a stupid name! Who on earth called him Xaviour?'

I wanted to crawl under the nearest table. I doubt she had a clue about how rude she sounded.

She was also a great one for uttering totally unPC and racially sensitive words without any clue they were offensive. When I once told her she shouldn't call the Asian man who ran her corner shop a p**i she was totally at a loss to know what she'd said wrong and asked 'what should I call him then?'

Yes mine too Anya, on telling her I was having a small facial mole removed she said something along the lines of "that's good dear, why did you wait so long, it isn't attractive" I would hasten to add that she wasn't nasty I got on with her very well, but she did say the first thing that popped into her head sometimes.

Ooops way off subject.

you must have felt like saying to her ( in both cases)" you do know that you said that out loud, don't you?"

POGS in response to your query re friends etc. and diversity of the community where people live..not offended at all. I used to live in Sth London and neighbours included families of various faiths, with origins in all continents. I have had work colleagues from a variety of ethnic/religious backgrounds. My friends reflect the variety in the community in which I lived and they have a range of skin colour and religious heritage. I have moved to an area that has less diversity (in terms of % of population but probably similar number of individuals locally with roots in as many different countries of the world.)

My own family is multi-racial, some of my cousins are Muslim, my Sis i L is Christian /Pakistani, my grandmother was Palestinian & my dad only came to England in 1947. My mum was from NE England and I have mostly, lived in Sth London with a brief spell in E Africa and NE England! I have worked in primary schools in highly socially and racially diverse areas of South London. My DH is white British and has no particular diversity in his family but was brought up in 'working class' and racially mixed Sth London, taught in schools that had mainly non-white pupils etc etc.

Not sure how this contributes to the debate about the atrocity in Tunisia. All my friends & family, of all faiths & none, of different ethnicities to my own are outraged, shocked and saddened by acts of terrorism, racism and bigotry.

Penstemmon

Sorry?

My question was to Anniebach not you.

Anniebach, I will just say this and then 'move on' but calling somebody a 'little Englander' only has one connotation in a thread like this, and most of us know this, whatever you say about meanings.If you did not know this, then you do now!

Hell bells, we have so often had discussions on this forum how different parts of the country have different sayings. I have explained several times little englander does not mean to me what it means to some here. I do imagine groups frantically contacting each other privately because of the ' we ' which have been used several times on this thread. So rosesarered, for you to claim 'most of us know this ' you must have had cosy little off thread chats. How sad grown women working in bully gangs . I am not brave enough to start a thread but I would very much like to explain what a little englander is to me , useless because like a coven some would attack and tell me I was in the wrong no matter it would be my experience, my explanation , my opinion.

PM-ing of that kind is the black side of GN - if it does go on.

Go on Annie - start the thread. Would be interesting. You don't need to be brave.

Then will someone explain how ' and most of us know this' can be said in honesty ? Was there a poll which I missed jingle ? Even a pea brain realises it had to be discussed before anyone could step forward as spokesperson

I don't know how to start a thread or where it would belong

I am glad you wrote your post Anniebach.

I did look back at what you wrote, and couldnt see how it could mean anything other than what others think it means too.

But I am the first to say and admit that there are different sayings in different parts of the country.

So I am wrong.
And also would welcome hearing what it means to yourself. Or the Welsh.

I dont think that you need to start a new thread though. Say it here?

I'm not disputing that it goes on. Just no way of knowing really.

"Other subjects" is a good fall-back forum.

Click on 'Forums' under the GN banner up there. Then find 'Other subjects', or whatever. Click on that, and take it from there. Easy peasy.

Easy to get paranoid about what you think might be going on behind your back on here, Annie!

I'm with soontobe in that I'd be glad to know what you mean by 'little Englander' so the rest of us on this thread can be in no doubt.

noun
a person who opposes an international role or policy for England (or, in practice, for Britain)

That's what the dictionary says. There are further definitions which include xenophobic, anti-colonialism, when, for instance used in the days of the British Empire, and anti-interventionist (Afghanistan).
I suspect the term is used in so many ways today as to be made to mean whatever one wants it to mean.

POGS With reference to the Diwali incident you mentioned, I think the remark "What is that white woman doing here?" is not a laughing matter and I hope the "gentleman" in question (whatever his age) was quietly told by someone that it was not acceptable. I think the way in which you dealt with it was very gracious but I sincerely hope that, at some stage, someone put him right.

Discourtesy and intolerance is, in my view, not acceptable from whomever it may come. However, it is easier to withstand such a remark when you are part of the ethnic majority. When you are part of an ethnic minority it may feel a good deal more intimidating and hurtful.

I find it difficult to believe that some people are unaware that the terms "Paki" "Chink", etc. etc. are offensive. If they continue to use those terms after being told that they are unacceptable, that would reinforce my feeling that their choice of words was deliberate.

I am not paranoid Ana, how can anyone speak for others unless they have discussed it with others ?

Soutra,thank you

Well, no one's discussed it with me!

fair enough, I have offended some English posters because they assumed I was accusing them of bring boorish, xenophobic etc but I was not and have said so several times, no matter, you will believe what you choose to believe

just saying and I will be brief :
if someone accused me of being a 'little Englander' (originally meant someone who was against the expansion of the British Empire) I would find it 'racist' and rude because of the connotations now attached to the word. So many threads are very vociferous about the use of certain words and the effect they have on the person addressed - to my mind little Englander comes under that category and has no place in civilised debate
there said my piece and how I feel
nobody should call anyone a 'little Englander' even if in all innocence of the unpleasant connotations of the word.