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New minimum wage

(102 Posts)
thatbags Fri 10-Jul-15 10:41:28

Can this be right? Fraser Nelson on how the new minimum wage will benefit the better off much more than the poor.

durhamjen Fri 10-Jul-15 12:32:38

You cannot separate the new minimum wage from the benefit cuts.

The IMF agrees with Fraser Nelson.

jinglbellsfrocks Fri 10-Jul-15 12:39:27

I don't understand all the ins and outs of this, but I feel slightly disturbed about it all. Perhaps the Conservatives are paying too much attention to party ideals, and not enough to individuals. It is worrying.

durhamjen Fri 10-Jul-15 12:44:06

Not party ideals. The minimum wage was brought in by the Labour party and opposed all the way by the Tories.

They have never believed in the living wage, even though Boris is trying to bring it in in London. He's a Tory maverick.
Osborne's living wage is a pretend living wage. I do not think there are any Tory councils that espouse the living wage.
So what do you mean by party ideals?

durhamjen Fri 10-Jul-15 12:49:28

If you want to find out which employers in your region pay the living wage at the moment, here's a link.

There is also a response on the website to the budget.

Anya Fri 10-Jul-15 12:53:32

That must be the same Fraser Nelson, Editor of the Spectator who said he'd bet £1,000 that Ed Milliband would win the election?

hmm obviously has his finger on the pulse!

durhamjen Fri 10-Jul-15 12:54:57

What about the IMF agreeing with him?

vampirequeen Fri 10-Jul-15 13:00:43

Even if my daughter's employer immediately increases her wage to the £9 minimum wage which isn't due to be implemented until 2020 she will still be much worse off than if she continued at the current minimum wage and the current tax credit.

durhamjen Fri 10-Jul-15 13:01:15

There's an IMF chart in this article, showing the effects of the budget on each decile.

Anya Fri 10-Jul-15 13:08:09

What? The IMF thought Ed Milliband would win the election?

Anya Fri 10-Jul-15 13:13:22

I can see this thread is going to be a replica of the Summer Budget one which has been hijacked by the far left. So is there anything to be gained?


durhamjen Fri 10-Jul-15 13:15:22

Those in the second decile on that chart are going to lose the most. They are the people who earn between £11,100 and £13,100.
They will lose £1200.

I am sure you will mock that too, Anya.
I feel sorry for you if all you can do is mock the poor or those who are concerned about the poor.

vampirequeen Fri 10-Jul-15 13:36:08

Is 'far left' meant to be an insult?

Do you consider my post about my daughter losing out to be an indication of my political views rather than a statement about how the changes will affect a 25 year old mother of two who works to supplement her partner's full time income which is also very low? Her wages don't pay for holidays and treats. She works to put food on the table and pay the rent. Her income will be slashed by the tax credit cuts. She will still have the same rent. Her family will still need to eat.

Do only members of the 'far left' think this is wrong?

durhamjen Fri 10-Jul-15 13:36:53

Exactly, vampire.
It's an argument between employers and the government, with the workers stuck in the middle as usual.

The Tory government will never realise that the way to get out of the mess is to give the poorest more to spend in this country. Giving the rich more just means they can save more to pass on to their children - even more now the inheritance threshold has gone up.

durhamjen Fri 10-Jul-15 13:48:04

" The reality is that you’re more likely to find a swan and unicorn pasty in your local Greggs shop than see the attitude of Cameron’s government be anything other than sly and vindictive when it comes to people on low incomes.

David Cameron favours the idea of a regional minimum wage. This basically means lower, or higher wages for doing the same work, depending on where you live; a kind of postcode lottery for pay if you like.

We need to be extremely cautious over the Scottish National Party’s demand for devolving powers surrounding the minimum wage. This move would bring about an end to the national minimum wage.

The break up of a UK wide national minimum wage could see England and Wales which, as we know has an in-built Tory majority, scuppering any attempt to increase it, driving wages down not up with Scottish MPs barred from taking part in debates or votes which don’t affect Scotland.

The SNP could actually find themselves enabling David Cameron's nightmarish vision of lower pay in some regions, particularly northern (probably Labour-run) constituencies and in the SouthWest where some health trusts tried to break away from national pay bargaining during the last 5 years.

Regional pay would weaken the BFAWU’s ‘Hungry For Justice’ campaign, which is calling for no worker in the UK to be paid less than £10 an hour."

Didn't know where to post this. It is relevant to so many threads.

Anya Fri 10-Jul-15 13:50:26

No VQ your single post is not hijacking!

Anya Fri 10-Jul-15 13:54:02

I would have enjoyed a good sensible discussion on Bags post and am quite happy to debate the pros and cons raised in it, but unfortunately it's the same old, same old ranting. It's almost enough to make me vote Tory in the next election.

Anya Fri 10-Jul-15 13:59:05

How many hours a week does your daughter work VQ?

Anya Fri 10-Jul-15 14:04:35

DJ I have every sympathy for those who are struggling to make ends meet. What benefit to them or anyone is this constant ranting against things you cannot change, at least until the next election?

Can I ask what you actually do to help those in need. Have you, for instance, helped out at a homeless shelter or run a food bank perhaps?

You see I believe that actions do speak louder than words.

vegasmags Fri 10-Jul-15 14:04:50

The London living wage was set in Nov 14 for the following year at £9.15. I take your point durhamjen about the pitfalls of regional minimum wages, but this proposed £9 which won't be introduced for another 5 years, is already not sufficient to meet the basic needs of those living in London, let alone in 2020.

grannyonce Fri 10-Jul-15 14:12:42

anya - I hear what you are saying but not many others do grin
DJ - did you really mean to post the same thoughts on this and the Budget thread?

Anya Fri 10-Jul-15 14:33:00

Thanks G1 at least someone is listening.

grannyonce Fri 10-Jul-15 14:38:18

my pleasure anya - I do wish the thread would not always go the way they do and there would be reasonable idscussion of the facts.
the link in the OP is interesting - thank you for pointing it out - thatbags

Gracesgran Fri 10-Jul-15 14:39:17

Would it be possible to stop the accusations of extreme leftism. No one that I have read on this forum seems to be positioned on the extreme left although they may not share the views of other posters and, of course it will depend how far to the right those poster are as to where they consider the far left to be.

If you add up the number of times each person has posted on this particular thread then the only one that comes anywhere close to hijacking is you Anya with post after post which seem to have no intention to discuss the OP but just to have a go at all an sundry who don't share, or even may not share, your view. What a waste of space and time.

thatbags Fri 10-Jul-15 15:21:19

Haha! I did enjoy anya's first post on this thread grin.