Cameron Shaming the Country

merlotgran - you are right. Could all be part of a bigger plot.

Lots of people now rushing vanloads of aid to Calais and I applaud their efforts.
I have been less concerned about them as they are relatively safe. It's the families and children that concern me most and I have to agree that transporting them directly from the camps is safer and generally more sensible.
I assume they'll be brought to UK and then be taken to wherever homes are offered.
I'm pleased that the Scottish government is offering refuge and an email from my local councillor assures me that the provision of homes locally is already under discussion.

Wales offered shelter several days ago, if any refugees do come and settle with us hope they like rain

Looks like we'll be offering refuge to 4000 from the camps.

This is an extremely good idea all round. The only thing that slightly bothers me is the fact that homeless people who are citizens of the UK who have been desperate for housing for an eternity never seem to have their problems addressed with the same enthusiasm, and I'm just wondering how this will be viewed by these homeless famillies! I'm sure I'll be shouted down for daring to even suggest that this could be a bone of contention, but I can't help feeling that long term it might be.

You are right, nigglynellie. Could be a problem and rightly so. Anyone know what refugees (genuine ones) normally get offered. Someone at the pub told me accommodation and £30 a day?

Sometimes ' The road to hell being paved with good intentions' comes to mind. I just hope this isn't the long term result of all this chaos.

Most countries in the Middle East are run by completely undemocratic authoritarian regimes. Saudi Arabia (and several other kingdoms) is ruled by its royal family and the treatment of other than its own citizens is appalling (even its own citizens, particularly women, don't have a great time). To place groups of Syrians into an Arab environment may be very unwise as the religious/cultural beliefs and practices of each group may be completely alien and unacceptable. Also, since Saudi Arabia and some other Arab countries are suspected of supporting ISIS, for the majority of Syrians it would likely be a case of out of the frying pan into the fire.

Though, apparently, the UK government has allocated money for, presumably, the construction and upkeep of the refugee camps on the Syrian borders, I guess many Syrians would be reluctant to go to such camps for fear of remaining there indefinitely. Poorer countries have no option but to house refugees in very basic camps and, due to lack of resources, these refugees may spend a lifetime there. Rich countries subsidising such refugee camps seems to me to be very much a case of "out of sight, out of mind".

Young men are not immune to bombs being dropped on them or being attacked by fundamentalists groups or being conscripted into an army on behalf of a government or religious faction with which they disagree. They may disagree with all "sides" and not wish to fight - and I don't blame them. Although I agree that families with young children should be prioritised, are young men not entitled to seek safety elsewhere?

I find the implication that lots of people who are fleeing their countries are somehow "working the system" very unpleasant. If they are reasonably well dressed or can afford to pay for transport/train tickets, etc., their authenticity is immediately called into question. But money can't save you from being bombed, massacred or of being unable to access food and water because your country is in absolute chaos.

Jane10 Using terms like "the red grans" is, in my opinion, unnecessarily provocative and just plain childish.

But they are Red Grans! and they at times intimidate other posters to the point of not posting anything even remotely contradictary to their views. Hence being wary of being shouting down!

That's certainly true Niggly! I don't think they know quite how they come over to other posters or would be posters. I don't doubt their sincerity though.

Do tell nigglynellie , just what is a red gran? Is it a name given to people on the left in politics? If so those on the far right are jackboots yes?

No, they would be Blue Grans, of course...

They should know exactly how they come across Jane or are they lacking the 'wee sleekit beastie' gene?

To be a Jackboot gran you would have to be aggressive, always right (forgive the pun!), and constantly browbeating others into agreeing with your way of thinking! For blue grans this just isn't the case, any difference of opinion is made timidly and tentatively, while being prepared to be metaphorically shot down in flames. We seem easily terrorized so silencing us is not a hard job.

Speak for yerself, niggly!

(and I have the scars to prove it!)

Of course there is more afoot, merlotgran.
I have heard reports from those who take aid to the camps in Turkey that allegedly they have infiltrated schools in the camps.
Don't imagine that all the refugees are innocent souls fleeing persecution, although most will be.

Speaking personally, I am a lovely peaches and cream. (I wish!)

Or it could be rust with all this Welsh rain that anniebach mentioned!

Yes I do think we should take our fair percentage of the Syrian refugees, as they are just that refugees and not economic migrants. Their need is immediate and they need to be helped right now. Nevertheless, given the number of migrants this country takes from both inside and outside the EU, and the fact that population has increased by several million in the past couple of years, perhaps we should offset taking a fair number of Syrians against further prospective migration, particularly from outside the EU, and especially for those who do not have a skill or expertise that we require. We have an acute housing, school places shortage, particularly here in London and planned affordable housing seems to be a dribble rather than the tidal wave of accommodation that needs to be provided to cope with our burgeoning population. You can't just have mass migration without the infrastructure and space to deal with it. I know we do still have empty areas, but I think it's fair to say that newcomers will want to settle where there are jobs and opportunities so they are going to be in competition with settled communities for the housing, schooling and hospitals.

Victor Orban the Prime Minister of Hungary has stated that Hungary is a predominantly Christian country and they are not very open to being overwhelmed by Muslims. Whilst I don't agree that it is Eastern Europe's prerogative to be part of the EU, and to expect to remain a mono culture. I can see where his concerns spring from. There is an element within that religion that is proselytizing and as alarming as Christianity was at it's absolute worst. Eastern Europe will no doubt look towards it's western counterparts and know that a small percentage of our Muslim population do not like our way of life, do not wish to integrate with us and come to the west wishing to continue with cultural practices where are unacceptable and often illegal. Maybe therefore he wishes to forestall a potential lack of cohesion down the line.

I'm only a pale blue gran but can strap on hob nailed Birkenstocks if required!

So bullshit to an opinion was given timidly Nellie?

Rosesarered , you can be peaches and cream , here in the mountains it's rust

I'm very brave on election day under the cover of anonymity, as are, obviously, quite a lot of other people!

nigglynellie I really object to your comment "But they are Red Grans! and they at times intimidate other posters to the point of not posting anything even remotely contradictary to their views. Hence being wary of being shouting down!"

As I have said before, why on earth wouldn't somebody post because others might disagree with them? You are anonymous on this site so what are you frightened of? God help us if this country were ever invaded if people feel intimidated and frightened just because others might not agree with them. There are several people on this thread who have expressed support for Cameron's stance. They express their views strongly, which they are entitled to do, and I wouldn't call that "shouting down" or go hiding away in a corner because I felt "intimidated".

Anyway, if you look through this thread you will find that there is quite an even balance of views. Nobody is shouting anybody down and there was even a jokey moment when durhamjen was put in charge of the world for a couple of seconds. But some people do like to make the occasional dig, e.g. referring to "Corbyn worshippers" and "red grans" and making sarcastic comments. They are, fortunately, in the minority.

Hmm...someone referred to a tory voter as a 'fascist' a few days ago - it cuts both ways, Eloethan!