EU - I'm in a quandary

Quite a thought isn't it?

It has brought about some strange bedfellows

Corbyn is quite posh, lived in a posh house, went to posh schools so it would be difficult to deride him. I'm sorry you had such a horrid time at school dj, children can be very cruel and it is wretched to be on the receiving end of any tormenting, but surely it is something that intelligent right minded people grow out of. In adults it's born out of ignorance, spite and plain had manners. It's what people are like that matters not how they speak or conduct themselves. Posh or rough, it shouldn't be an issue.

We all have no say in where we are born, a hovel or a Palace. snobbery is stupid and inverted snobbery is just as stupid.

Equally none of us can help where our parents choose to send us to school, or anything else when we are children, therefore it is pretty ridiculous to go on about posh Eton boys, as if somehow they were responsible for their parents choice of education!

Parents have a lot to answer for

Trouble is they always know best, including us.

I like Rees Mogg, Andy Burnham Alan Johnson and Sadique Khan...not sure whether Khan is a bit devious though. He knew he couldn't control all aspects of London fares when he promised no fare rises for 4 years. London is cripplingly expensive for younger people and I voted for Khan to try and improve things for them. Sorry, gone way off topic.

Posh Eton boys are ruling this country, though. Posh Eton boys are on both sides of the referendum and one of them will carry on ruling this country.
Posh Eton boys have promised rich people lots of things, and promised that they will reduce immigration to less than 100,000.

Gullible people are being taken in by posh Eton boys.

www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/may/30/eton-provost-threatens-quit-tories-over-social-engineering-agenda-lord-waldegrave

Posh Eton boys disagree. One of them thinks it's wrong to discriminate against post Eton boys getting the top jobs, so he's going to resign from the Tory party.

Oh for goodness sake.

This is all crap.

Well in case anyone missed it, Sadiq Khan's dad was a bus driver and he grew up on a London council estate and if he does a good job as mayor he could be a future prime minister.

Just started the Brexit course.

Our civil service bods are the ones who are instrumental in drawing up EU policy in the EU Commision and are well known and respected for their capabilities.

Who'd have thought? Why isn't this well known?

Apparently for political reasons and agendas!

Why should Eton boys be discriminated against because they have been over-represented in top jobs? We need the best person for the job, whether it is a man, a woman or a hermaphrodite, from a slum or a mansion, married or single, hetero or homo, Christian, Jew, Muslim, Sikh, Buddhist, agnostic, atheist, so long as they can understand the job and do the work better than the competition, who gives a flying frog whether they are from a deprived or a priviliged background?

I personally have never criticised Corbyn or Ed Millband for being not the right sort for being PM because of how he talks or looks. sWhy criticise someone for talking posh or rough if that is how they talk naturally? If they put on pseudo-posh criticise that but not natural posh. Or pseudo-rough - just as bad.

I haven't criticised anyone at all because of how they talk or look, or where they went to school, whether it was a city-centre comprehensive or an expensive fee-paying school - and there are plenty of those with names that are not Eton or Harrow.

(I think this has been mentioned before on GN, and there were not as many "posh Eton boys" in government as you seem to think. They are not under every bed, as reds used to be said to be. Sorry, I don't have any statistics to quote and it is too late at night to go looking for them.)

I never criticised Michael Foot for his lack of dress sense either, or Maggie Thatcher for her rigidly lacquered hairstyle, or Edward Heath for his "elitist" love of classical music, or John Major for tucking his shirt into his underpants, or even Cherie Blair for any of her foibles.

These are irrelevancies, accidents of birth or of early influences. Nothing to do with their abilities. Heaven preserve us from prejudice, whoever it is against.

Did Cameron know that? Why didn't he tell us?

It's part of the game, isn't it?
Waldegrave saying he'll leave the Tory party if Eton boys aren't allowed to have all the top civil service jobs.
Interesting but predictable.
Posh Eton boys do not suffer from the fallout that their policies create.

Jevive, I knew Sadiq Khan's dad was a bus driver. So was my dad. Hope Sadiq doesn't follow Boris in the PM's job.

Gove said there were too many posh Eton boys in government, and he should know.

elegran I am interested in your discussion about Etonian educated people and their over representation in top jobs.

I think my argument is that it is about fairness. Only 7% of children are privately educated and so those going to Eton must be the tiniest percentage of the population as a whole.

A meritocracy is something I think we can agree about, but if so many of the cabinet come from private education backgrounds then meritocracy clearly is not working. These children have access to alls sorts of areas like networks closed to the state educated child. Of course there are exceptions which I applaud, but there is a severe underepresentation in so many fields, making the idea of a meritocratic UK far from reality.

Did he say those very words "if Eton boys aren't allowed to have all the top civil service jobs." which means that he wants them TO be allowed all of them, discriminated FOR, or did he say something more like if they are discriminated AGAINST? There is a difference!

whitewave Then what is needed is more education in leadership, civics, the constitution, how the country works, and that kind of thing, in schools that do not normally provide fodder for parliament, the cabinet and the premiership.

You don't get the best by excluding those who have so far produced leaders, you get it by bringing on leaders from places where they would not traditionally just pop up.

That is what the "top" schools do - they expect pupils to learn now the country is governed, take on responsibilities for themselves and other people, organise events, plan ahead and delegate stuff to others.

whitewave Have you heard of the Ten Tors Race? It is held on Dartmoor in Early May. www.tentors.org.uk/

"The Ten Tors Challenge is limited to 2,400 individuals (four hundred teams of six teenagers). The teams, depending on age, face hikes of 35, 45 or 55 miles (56, 72 or 88km) over the rough terrain of Dartmoor, visiting ten nominated tors / check points in under two days. The teams must be self-sufficient, carrying all that they need to complete their route and stay out over night safely. The weather can be very changeable and at times quite extreme, and success or failure can depend very much on the extent to which a team has been trained for all eventualities. "

The teams train under an adult, but for the event they are on their own, with a mobile phone sealed into a plastic bag for use only in emergencies. There are plenty of people ready to come to their aid, and they have the right maps and equipment, but they are expected to organise themselves and make decisions on the hoof.

The teams come from all kinds of schools but the ones who do well are those who have been properly trained for it, who are led by somone who can think about a problem when it arises and make the right decisions, and, most importantly, can have the rest of the team working together and not against each other.

That is not political - it is personal development. But that is what the public schools teach, and that is the kind of leadership that a potential prime minister or cabinet minister needs to have at his finger tips - and it is why the "posh Eton boys" get to the top jobs. It is the kind of thing that we need to bring out in those who would not have dreamt of going into politics if we want our future leaders to come from all parts of society.

That is an elitist viewpoint, which makes the assumption that children from 95% of the country do not have the qualities to run a country. Of course we know that isn't true and there are many examples of outstanding leaders in their fields who have not had the "benefit" of a private education.

We helped to run the Ten Tors. We entered a team of ordinary working class 15 year olds in 1976? The extreme my hot summer. Most teams dropped out. Our team finished. None of them became cabinet ministers or even leaders in their field. Their life chances simply didn't match up.

Posh Eton Boys/Champaign Socialists.

Neo Natzis /Communists.

Guardian/Daily Mail.

Shit don't stink/Thick as Pig Shit.

Anymore stereotypes , prejudices anyone?

.

Wow!

I am always careful to avoid stereotypes. But am interested if I am guilty of that and in which post.