The one indisputable FACT in this referendum debate

I wish Bob Geldorf [sp]had mentioned this today when he was shouting at Farage on the Thames. He is on Question Time tomorrow, I believe....I hope he has that information and uses it then. I don't understand how people can talk about the EU not being democratic and yet, at the same time pay so much attention to Farage, who isn't even an elected MP now.

@Jalima

From what I know of the fishing industry, the UK also had/has huge trawlers which empty the sea where the operate, so it wasn't just other countries (EU or not). Iceland isn't in the EU. If they'd all been allowed to carry on, the fish stocks would have died out.

From what I remember and have read, the Conservative government at the time didn't fight hard enough for the UK fishing industry and didn't get a very good deal. My understanding is that the rules were relaxed a few years ago.

What really gets me about fishing is that Farage was on the EU fishing committee for three years and only attended one of 42 meetings. He didn't even TRY to do anything. Apparently, UKIP's policy is not to take part in anything which will affect (even benefit) the UK, so why accept the role and the associated benefits and not let somebody who would have tried to improve the situation have a go? He sacrificed the UK fishing industry for those three years for a principle.

openeurope.org.uk/today/blog/the-mechanics-of-leaving-the-eu-explaining-article-50/

Just seen a Fulfact on Gove's speech. Then I realised it was from 18th April. Even the phrasing was the same!

Yep- ignore article 50 at your peril- there will be no chance at all to negotiate anything with the rest of the EU, I'm afraid.

Oh I've read a bit further Not possible. But what it does make clear is that Brussels holds all the cards. Something that we signed up to. I don't think the balance of power in Brussels favour can be overestimated.

If he thought the Guardian shouldn't hound a 79 year old man, he shouldn't have mentioned the man. Of course they are going to check up on his dad after that. Anyway, who would take Gove at his word.

Just looking at article 50. Apparently when/if we invoke it the other 27 will get together without the UK and decide terms. We then wi be clef in as it were and told the terms - we can then start to negotiate.

I wonder if once the negotiations are complete whether it will be put to us as a referendum?

He lost it a bit then - he was quite peeved!

I think Gove lost that one, whitewave.
"Wolf in sheep's clothing". He shouldn't have kept mentioning all the things the government had done wrong when he's been part of it for all six years. He certainly shouldn't have kept going on about his dad's business.

Oh, x posts again.

Pax Romana

from the Latin 'mare'
'Mare Nostrum' (the Med) and all that although the English Channel was the Oceanus Britannicus - rather a grand name for a narrow stretch of water.
(unless it's changed since I was at school, it was a long time ago )

Oh sorry -blimey I do get in muddle -I meant close to shore sea environment. It's time I stopped!

Oh, I thought Marine was to do with the sea whitewave

This is talking about inland waters jalima

No definately a threat. But Osborne was being Osborne. Faced with a downturn his instinct is to cut. Labour would go for growth so will vote against his budget. No denying a possibility of a downturn - Brexit has said that will happening. We are beginni g to see it at the moment with the FTSE and sterling

Did you see PMQs today? Corbyn mentioned that a flotilla of ships was supposed to be coming up the Thames, with Farage aboard. He said he kept looking out for it but hadn't seen any sign of it yet.

I am really looking forward to a fullfact check on Gove's talk tonight. He really was born in the wrong century.

I am not sure about the fishing issue whitewave. Our fishing industry has been decimated by EU rules and huge fishing trawlers from other countries in the EU; DBIL's business depended on a vibrant fishing industry which has been decimated. Had we not been in the EU and the UK government introduced sensible quotas it would not been in the poor state it is today. DBIL did find alternative work on the super-yachts of the wealthy, however. Every cloud.

1 out of the 42 EU meetings on fishing!

That scumbag Farage dares complain about the Fisheries Commission- as an MEP he attended

ONE

our of the

42

where he was supposed to help protect the UK fishermen.

Just ONE- whilst picking up his MEP cheque every month without fail. Sick.

Gove is such a liar. I had to record it and am watching it now.
He voted with the government on every cut to the NHS. He wants an insurance based NHS, even though he said he believed in it.

In fact he has never voted against the government on anything in this parliament or the last. Hypocrite.
Or "Off your rocker" as the audience member said.

Is anyone going to deny that George Osborne has made a threat today?

Just watching country file about Marine Conservation set up by the UK - which is vital for fish numbers and ecogical reasons. However the government fell at the first hurdle because of pressure from fishermen.

This has nothing to do with the EU.

One worries about other areas of our environment if Brexit occurs.

It would certainly seem so, judging by some of the posts on this and other EU threads.

that famous socialist Jacob Rees Mogg Leave Jakey alone

I should think a lot of people are voting for selfish reasons djen