Labour MP Jo Cox shot in Birstall

Great post Tegan

I agree we should fight hate in all its forms, but I am confused as some of the comments posted on this and other threads against those supporting the Leave campaign do verge on hate.

This poor woman was killed carrying out her duties as an MP so it can be assumed her death was politically motivated, however, we don't KNOW. I prefer to think of the loss to her family of a mother and wife before I start jumping to conclusions about the motives of the person who did this.

Sorry, DJ, I don't think he's sane at all.
I'm off out and away from this thread, I can't be doing with the attitudes of some of you!

I don't think there is any doubt as to the man's mental instability. That of course may well have made him vulnerable and easily influenced by extremist views.
I believe "terrorism" is a conscious desire to further a political aim by acts of violence against sections of society.
Whether or not he is considered sane enough to plead is not for us to conjecture at this point.

Merlot, you said that Anniebach sounded as if she was creating plenty of hate of her own.
Anniebach is a Labour supporter as you well know.
You appeared to be comparing Annie to Britain First.
I just asked if you were.
Thanks for confirming that you are not.
In that case, what are you saying? Annie doesn't hate anyone. But she does stand up for justice, like many of us.

If he wasn't considered sane enough to plead, he would not have been in court today charged with her murder.

Just read that. It seems pretty clear that in Mair's mind the murder was politically motivated.

It would be good if the people who want to discuss 'isms' did so on a separate thread. The death of Jo Cox should be treated with respect and not used for any political ends. It was a tragedy and her family must be devastated. She was a hard working MP with principles and values a great loss to the country.

@Juggernaut

Writing the murder off as an act of mental instability is quite insulting to those with mental health issues. There are thousands of depressives and OCD sufferers in the UK. Very few of them commit violent crimes. No doubt Mair's lawyers will try to argue that he is insane, but from what the public knows, he doesn't appear to be.

At last a fact - 5 minutes ago

^"Thomas Mair gave his name as "Death to traitors, freedom for Britain" when he appeared at Westminster Magistrates' Court.

The defendant, who was wearing a grey, police issue tracksuit, refused to give his correct name and did not reply when asked to confirm his address and date of birth."^

NOW it is justifiable to make assumptions about his motives.

Over and out to all you theorists.

Would have thought so - pretty obvious.

daphnedill
My mother was a psychologist, so seriously, I'm probably the last person who would be insulting to or about anyone with mental health issues.
There is a lot more to mental illness than just depression and OCD you know, and as somone who suffers dreadful depression I object to your insinuation that depressives and OCD sufferers are insane.
You have a lot to learn about mental health issues, a little education on such matters may stop you making such ridiculous comments in future.

@Juggernaut

Yes, I know. Strangely enough, I also have a very close relative with qualifications in mental health as long as your arm. I was very careful to say 'from what the public knows'. It IS in the public domain that he suffered from depression and OCD and was/is epileptic.

As you're such an expert, you'll know that criminal insanity is not the same thing as the general public's view of insanity. You will also know that one of Lee Rigby's murders has been diagnosed as schizophrenic and is in Broadmoor, yet is still considered to be a terrorist.

Elegran, I think you'll find I put that fact on at 10.43

Nice to have it confirmed by you.

I wonder what the reaction would have been if he'd said "Allahu Akbar"

He'd have definitely been a terrorist then, although the wrong colour. That's confusing, daphne.

I wasn,t aware of Jo Cox and her work until this week.Though I don,t agree with some of her views,she seems to have been a very energetic,committed and thoroughly good person.She has tolerated months of internet abuse and sexual threats,as do others in the public arena,and I am baffled as to why she wasn,t given some sort of protection.
I read today,that her killer had asked for help recently,as he was concerned by his own mental state.
To those referring to the far right groups in this country being a threat if we leave the EU....they will not be tolerated any more than they are today.
The vast majority of people supporting Brexit,do so in the hope of a better UK for the future,and are honourable people who despise the likes of BNP.
There is no political gain to be made from this poor womans death...primarily,she was a MUM.
Her little children are more important than anyones political views.

Merlot, I have never known hate , was taught when very young that hatred is a cancer which eats at the hater, speaking out against injustice is not hatred . I have always fought against racism, and am very sad my grandchildren will now experience a world of hate not a world of tolerance for race, colour and creed. So deep sadness not hate merlot

There are many different sorts of mental illness and any sufferer, whatever their condition, deserves our sympathy and respect as a fellow human being. However we cannot duck the fact that there are some mental illnesses that cause paranoia which in turn can lead to violent acts - hence the need for Broadmoor Hospital where people who have committed violent acts due to their mental illness can be safely housed.

This gunman was known to the mental health services in his area and it may be that they underestimated the degree to which his mental health problems might make him prey to fascist or terrorist influences. Delusions of grandeur and power are known to be a part of psychotic illness and the sorts of ideas that extremist groups purvey can have a huge appeal to someone with these problems.

The fine line between having a serious mental illness and simply being a criminal is sometimes hard to define.

I am concerned about the state of our mental health services where care in the community is underfunded; and even if it were better funded, it is very difficult to be sure that someone with paranoia or delusions of grandeur is taking their medication regularly enough to make them not a threat.

No, I wasn't really aware of her before this awful happening. But now I'm thinking she might well have made an excellent Prime Minister in years to come.

Oops. That was meant to follow on from Granny2016's post.

I don,t give a gnats b.... who posts something first,in the middle or last!
Everyone does not have the time or inclination to read all posts before writing their own.
Pity that such pettiness has crept into this,very serious discussion.

The BNP , Britain First and UKIP also support the out vote granny 2016.

And fact, the remain in were in the lead until Brexit started to use the race card, they are now ahead

@Granny2016

But they ARE tolerated today!

Would he have been anywhere but in the community if there were still living in places available?