Being blamed

@durhamjen

Just read the link about Ebbw Vale. Sorry to say this, but it really does lend weight to the argument that Leavers are thickos.

I read that Cornwall and Wales want extra money from Westminster when we leave the EU. I hope they don't mind joining the queue with the NHS, farmers, fishermen, universities, scientific research and hundreds of others who will lose funding. Errrmmm...how much was it again?

daphnedill - I do not see myself as a Leaver - but as someone who had a very hard decision to make and marginally came down on the Leave side. I am not ashamed of my decision and see no reason to dodge the question. I have no problem that others hold a different view. I do object to posters who dismiss those with a different view as "thickos" though - that is not acceptable.

I hear all you say about immigration, but as long as successive governments ignored public concern and allowed a poor underclass to develop, then inevitably the subtleties on the subject that you describe would be lost and anger would be hard to contain.

The fatcats and the devious bankers have been laughing all the way to the bank and there was bound to be some sort of backlash. If you find yourself at the bottom of the heap and are watching others with their euro millions you will grab at any chance to have a say of some sort. If these people feel powerless in a UK context, how much more powerless must they feel in an EU context?

It is all so sad and divisive.

Ceesnan You've got the three-crop thing arse end foremost back to front. Yet another Euromyth.

Crop diversification is the aim, to "address environmental concerns related to pressures that modern farming has put on water, soil, farmland habitats and related biodiversity, as well as contributing to tackling climate change. Monoculture, for example, reduces soil fertility and increases demand for fertilisers and plant protection products, which in turn can lead to water pollution and harm biodiversity." so " farms with more than 30 hectares of arable land will need to grow three crops. Farm of more than 10 hectares will be required to grow two crops and small farms will be excluded from all “greening” requirements." They can grow MORE than the two or three if they wish - otherwise how could anyone grow salad crops, or use the same land for a sequence of crops?
blogs.ec.europa.eu/ECintheUK/agriculture-myths-cropping-the-facts-on-the-three-crop-rule/

EE, daphne. You'll get a slap on the wrist for that.

£350 million a week? I am still trying to find the list of promises. Definitely more than that so far.

Candelle, I am desperately unhappy about the outcome of this referendum, and was totally against it even taking place.

But it did and the majority vote surely has to stand. I don't see how we can set out the referendum rules after the event. It's a damn shame nobody had the sense to do so beforehand though

Sorry, Lucky, but if you came down marginally on the leave side and voted leave, you are a leaver, however you dress it up. Unfortunately the rest of us have to leave with you.

Just heard that a lot of people voted leave because Obama wanted them to remain.
These are the very people who want us to be able to sell more to the US.

@Luckygirl

Do you honestly think that we won't be even more prey to fat cats and bankers? The UK controls more tax havens than any other counry on the planet. We have a huge financial services sector on our soil. We have lax tax laws and enforcement agencies, which encourage dodgy investment. Foreign investment vultures are already circling to snap up property if prices fall. Did you know that Russians and Saudis are the biggest property owners by value in parts of West London? Is that what you want to continue?

Successive British governments have done virtually nothing to crack down on fat cats and bankers. The EU has done more and is beginning to discuss some serious measures. That's the very reason some of our own home-grown fat cats have been so keen to fund Vote Leave.

@durhamjen

If that's true, I hope they don't whinge about being called thick whingers.

This is what the NFU thinks.

www.theguardian.com/environment/2016/jun/26/uk-food-prices-set-to-rise-after-brexit-vote-farmers-union

Have you seen this, ceesnan?

Just had to check your spelling there, daphne. Whingers just doesn't look right, but it is.
Sounds like a football position, a thick whinger.

nanasam Rick Astley for Prime Minister! I needed cheering up and that hit the spot!

Just to follow up on the NFU topic: "The NFU Council resolves that on the balance of existing evidence available to us at present, the interests of farmers are best served by our continuing membership of the European Union."

Yes Durhamjen i met someone who said she'd been on a cruise and "they all" had decided that they would vote Leave because Obama said Remain. Lots of people voted Leave because they hate Cameron too. What a mess.

Marianne
Unfortunately only 24% of the next generation (under 25s) voted
Where did this statistic come from please? I've searched and can't find anything...
Something similar was being bandied about on Mumsnet along with a link to a document that said nothing of the sort. (It showed that if various demographic groups were put in order of who was most likely to vote, under 25's came 24th. It was also based on a survey completed in May - not even an exit poll). As far as I am aware, voting is by secret ballot; no one knows who voted and any figures that are produced are from a small sample poll.
I am only querying this, because I feel that we have had enough 'lies, damn lies and statistics' in the last weeks/months and look where that has got us! All the young people I know voted and are blaming the politicians not the older generation for the result.

Or, who voted for people like Farage, who has been pickin up their excellent MEP salary but have not attended, nor have they sat on the Commissions they were elected to to make a difference
yes, but the way the voting works is that we can end up with a UKIP MEP (sorry, could have had) without the majority voting for them.
www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-27187434

I certainly wouldn't have thrown my toys out of the pram if remain had won. It just looks like childish tantrums and cries of " It's not fair - I wanted to win," just my opinion of course.....

I am not throwing my toys out the pram, but I am very concerned about what lies ahead. As an optimist I hope things do work out well, but part of me thinks that this has limited the horizons for my DGC.

Of course, by the time they are old enough to go out into the world, it may all have changed.

The other reason I have signed the petition is because the vote was so close and quite a number of people interviewed seem startled by the result - although they say they voted to leave, they thought the vote would go to Remain
Illogical!

Having spoken to friends today (well-educated, well-travelled, high-achieving professionals) they have given me an insight into why they voted out and I respect their views and their decision.

DH said today that a higher proportion of older people voted, but the turnout amongst young people was much lower. Older people in the main voted for Brexit, young people to Remain according to polls. However, if older people were conscientious enough to make the effort to get out and vote and young people did not bother turn out in such numbers - they cannot then blame older people for the result.

A shocking wake-up call for them - exercise your franchise.

What is astounding is the amount of people who voted out would now vote remain

When I asked someone why farmers were voting leave I was told it was because the landowner receives the grant/subsidy and often doesn't pass it on to tenant farmers. Which isn't actually the fault of the EU imo.

I voted Remain. Proud of it too

The population of over 65s in the UK is approximately 19% (2014, may be slightly more now)

The population of under 16s is approximately 19% (2014)

Assuming there is a population of 5% of 16-18 year olds in the UK, that leaves a total % of people between 18 and 65 eligible to vote of:
57%

Of the 65+ age group - polls suggest that 40% voted to Remain

So will they please stop blaming older people for Brexit and start looking to their own inertia and apathy.

my reasons for voting out were similar to luckygirl. It was because i care deeply about the UK. I certainly didn't expect the Brexit to happen. I thought it would be on a knife edge with the Remains just winning!

Percentages , blame game, abusive name calling , all serve no purpose other than to perpetuate the hatred that has gone on for weeks.

How sad.

Sorry, POGS was just putting the percentages on to show that by far the majority of voters are 18-55 or so and are now complaining that the older generation has wrecked their futures.
Despite the fact that a fairly high percentage of older voters voted to Remain.

Their reason for lashing out is not logical.

You are overegging the pudding pogs no-one of us leavers have suggested that we hate anyone. We may hate the fallout and argue strongly our case but to talk of hate as you continually have done serves only to inflame the situation. But perhaps that is what you want