As the hysterical left weep into their lattes...

^"Wasn't the whole point of the EU that there were no more wars in Europe, Elegran?
Do you really think we ought to go back to those days?"^ Where did I say I wanted to go back to war, DJ? but I do want to go back to the spirit of "all in this together because it threatens us all and we all need to overcome it"

"We shall survive? Our children and grandchildren expect more than that bunker mentality." The first necessity is to avoid accepting that we will NOT survive. That is not a bunker mentality, that is to get the adrenaline going to succeed instead of waiting for defeat.

This is the biggest challenge the country has faced since 1945. Leave or remain, it has become obvious that a great deal of consultation, planning and sheer bloody hard graft is going to be needed. We are capable of producing it.

@Alea

I'm afraid I disagree with you. To me, it's very divisive. The whole nasty campaign has let loads out of Pandora's Box. I realise now that half the country doesn't have the same core values as I do and I think that is being felt on both sides. I really feel that this is about to become a darker, pettier and more mean-spirited country.

PS. But I didn't really expect people to understand.

Thank you thatbags for posting an article from the eminently sensible Libby Purves. I so agree, the vitriolic comments on the internet have been a disgrace to this nation. They have been posted by the liberal, elitist left, whether in the arts or not. Many of them show a very poor understanding of the real issues which have been ignored by the political elite for far too long. Time for a wake up call, it came on Thursday, now we have to get on with it, without whining and name calling. Frankly I think that's childish.

JCB cut 500 jobs last year and said that global trading was "tough" and blamed some of it on the strong pound. A weak pound will suit them.

Maggiemaybe There is no guarantee that EU funding would have still flowed into the UK if we were to remain in the union. With more poor countries joining funds would be diverted to raise standards there, effectively dumbing down living standards throughout Europe. Eastern Europe is much poorer and is needed to act as a barrier to any Russian expansion plans so it is fairly apparent that major funding will be directed that way to keep them sweet. Why would EU admit such poor countries if that were not the case?

@Elegran

But we really aren't all in this together. I don't expect you to understand that either. I really don't want to adopt the values of people who vote for 'sovereignty', 'taking back control', rejoicing that immigrants will have to go back home and don't even have a plan for the future.

My country has become very ugly.

@maddy

You should take off your blinkers and see the vitriol which has been posted every day to people who have supported Remain.

And you think this hasn't been divisive?

I almost wish there was a 'like' button for posts.

Well said, Nonio!

Anniebach, do you speak to different sorts of people?
durhamjen, yes it does take longer! Plus it takes longer to get there in the first place. Well worth it though. Also, I think it is important to shop in areas that are struggling, to put money into their economy.

People understand my point.

I have noticed there is quite a lot of pretending not to understand points on gransnet by a small number of posters. It is part of what they do.
[it doesn't just happen to me]
When that happens, I know the point has got through. And may well be remembered.

But the people who voted thoughtfully and for the right reasons, are still here in the country. Control won't be handed over to the racists and xenophobes. We will still have a government which wants the best for Britain, from whichever party. All is not lost by a long way. The mindless are still in the minority.

@puppytoe

Exactly JCB supported Leave because of what was in it for the company and shareholders. I hope some of the increased profit will filter back to the employees.

Was that a flying pig I saw?

(That, really, was to daphnedill)

@jinglebells

Do you have a crystal ball? I really don't share your optimism. This thread has done nothing to raise my spirits.

@obieone

So what's your vision? How are things going to improve?

that should have been 'who wants...' shouldn't it

Anyone watching Victoria Derbyshire now?

It's about all the racism that is happening now.

Please anyone who has a vote fot Tory leader, do not vote for Boris. Anyone who can say project fear is over has no idea.
50%of us are still very fearful of what will happen, and the racist abuse is happening now.

No, I think 'government' is a common noun.

Jesus, some of you are so far removed from reality, it's shocking!
You still don't appreciate the enormity of what the Leavers have done to the UK. I guess you will finally accept it when reality bites you in the pocket.

Feck sake, get your head out of your arses. This isn't the same as post war Britain. We're not in it together. You've effectively jumped off the super yacht into shark infested waters, on your own without a raft or even a paddle.

There's no grand plan. The only objective was to leave. You've done that, now what?

There is bugger all manufacturing or Industry left. Thatcher's government in the 80's put the boot in and China and other parts of Asia cherry picked the remains. Just take a look at a dozen or so random objects in your home, to see how much is still wholly manufactured in Britain.

I'm in Ireland (thank god!). We'll be hoovering up more of those companies currently based in the UK capital who now need an EU base for trading. They speak English here rather well too, so no worries about staff relocating needing a second language. Tax incentives for business are fantastic.

I live on the west coast and my local town has just opened a new internet hub for local business that offers connection speeds of 10,000mb, equal to Tokyo and Hong Kong, better even than London currently has to offer.

Yes, faster connection speeds than London...

In the last few years, we've had huge investment from the likes of Vodafone, Google, Amazon etc.

The EU won't collapse because the UK is falling apart.
Newsflash: The EU doesn't need Britain to prosper. It's the other way round.

Wake up and smell the Italian coffee.

I'm off to sip my latte now.

dd A common enemy has been fabricated, perhaps to divert attention from internal discontent, who knows? That is a favourite ploy of Machiavelli and co.

There is more than one blueprint for conducting international trade and social relations. The leave campaigners have rejected the EU pattern. If it was rejected for a better one, the better one will take root and succeed. Only time will prove whether it was a good decision, because a tree doesn't grow branches and fruit overnight. It has to be fed, watered, pruned, and nurtured.

If everyone is blaming everyone else for the blight in the orchard, no-one will be either feeding and pruning the existing trees or planting new saplings to replace them.

Can be either, daphne. It is confusing. I notice when someone in government says the government are, and it usually means collective responsibility, and I can pass the buck if necessary.

OK Elegran! Tell me about this 'better' way.

The term Racist is used far too often and in the wrong context. Many people have a strong protectionist instinct, we all have it like the feeling of annoyance when someone sits in our chair (just imagine it for a moment), or that overwhelming feeling of needing to protect when we have a baby.
Some display this instinct more strongly than others if they perceive a threat to their families, culture or livelihood, race is rarely the issue.

@Joelsnan

I disagree with you totally. I can't believe that people make apologies for racism and/or refuse to see it.

It was not a left/right issue. There was a Labour Leave campaign. I am a Labour party member and Corbyn supporter but I voted Out. Otherwise I agree with Thatchell though.
Spending weeks telling people they are morons and racists didn't work, but they won't stop doing it. It just alienates people even more.

Anniebach, do you speak to different sorts of people?
durhamjen, yes it does take longer! Plus it takes longer to get there in the first place. Well worth it though. Also, I think it is important to shop in areas that are struggling, to put money into their economy

Could you possibly GET more patronising??
Do you imagine Ab lives in an ivory tower? Or is this some obscure comment on living in Wales and Welsh-speakers? Tosh.
What do you mean by "areas that are struggling to put money into their economy" whose economy? . Quick shopping trips to Lithuania ? I actually believe in doing what I can to support THE economy by e.g.shopping at farmers' markets, local butchers, my village shop as well as that very equitable organisation the John Lewis Partnership because they actually share their profits with their staff and run their business a hell of a lot better than Osborne runs the economy!