Another awful day for France.

Just saw on news ISIL have claimed responsibility now Monica so I guess he was radicalised.

Sorry, about the error of who the murderer was in the Bristol case but it does not change the premise. We should not jump to conclusions about why someone has committed a crime, before it is clear what it is

We especially should be careful, about assuming a cause for a crime when that assumed cause is expanded to condemn a whole group of people because they share one characteristic with the perpetrator of the crime. Thirty six hours after the attack there is still no evidence the driver of this van had any terrorist connections.

Jalima speaking for Monica I think she meant Christopher Jefferies. Not Joanna's boyfriend. C.J. was arrested initially and all sorts of awful things said about his character. It ended up being nothing whatsoever to do with him. Guess she was just making the point that you shouldn't assume until you've got all the facts.

From what one of his neighbours said about his behaviour it appears that he was angry at everyone, it may be more like our Hungerford and Dunblane rather than any radicalisation. As a delivery driver he had access to a large lorry and in his twisted anger had stockpiled weapons to get back at families who were enjoying life; yes if you purposely want to terrorise others you are a terrorist. Whatever police or intelligence agencies do it would not prevent these distorted angry men carrying out heinous acts such as this lone deranged individual. I am sorry for all these innocent people and children and their kin, the future will never be the same.

Do you remember that murder case in Bristol? A girl was killed, the police took he landlord in for questioning, he was, tried, condemned and hung drawn and quartered by the media and public opinion. It turned out that he was absolutely innocent. The victim had been killed by her boyfriend.
Remember that and ponder.

No M0nica, the boyfriend of Joanna Yeates was completely innocent and not even in Bristol at the time. The murderer was a Dutch man, Vincent Tabak who lived in another flat in the house.

This is different. It is obvious that the lorry driver was the murderer of all these innocent victims; what is not obvious is his motive, whether he was a terrorist or a madman (or both).

Surely if you terrorise people then it is terrorism.

Guns etc in the cab

News showing photos of some of the victims. Heartbreaking, utterly heartbreaking. One young man who was killed was only one of three generations of the same family.

We know that he's separated from his wife and 3 children and is known to the police because of domestic violence. We've all seen on the news how that situation can result in tragedy. There's no doubt what has happened is terrorist like in nature, but it's too soon to be linking this to Islamic extremism.

Now an attempted Miltary coup in Turkey,whatever next,so sad for people involved in both atrocities.Thoughts are with them all.

So far we know little or nothing about the Nice killer beyond that he is muslim and from Tunisia and was unknown to the security services. Too many are making sweeping assumptions about the man, his political beliefs and cultural values simply because he is a muslim.

Do you remember that murder case in Bristol? A girl was killed, the police took he landlord in for questioning, he was, tried, condemned and hung drawn and quartered by the media and public opinion. It turned out that he was absolutely innocent. The victim had been killed by her boyfriend.

Remember that and ponder.

@Marie

I believe this man was Tunisian. As far as I know, it's not 'normal' for Tunisians to deliberately run people over with lorries. He didn't bring some weird Tunisian custom with him.

@namo

I agree with you. A prosecutor has said that the attack bore the hallmarks of terrorism, but I haven't read anything which links him with any group (maybe something will emerge). The description his neighbours have given seems remarkably similar to Jo Cox's murderer.

First night of the Proms tribute to the victims. The Albert Hall bathed in the tricolour and the orchestral version of the Marseillaise played to a silent, standing audience.

So touching.

I agree with Michel55, if people want to live in another country they should live as those of the country they move live. If we went to any Arab Country we would not get away with dressing as Westerners. I do think a lot of these people are high on drugs. No feeling only out of their brains.

Unless I've missed something, no-one has proved that he was a terrorist? "A disaffected petty criminal" maybe. Someone with a mental health problem? What is the EVIDENCE that he did this heinous act as a 'terrorist"? Haven't heard it yet. Unless I missed something?

What a shame that the police didn't notice that the Lorry wasn't refrigerated when he said he was delivering ice cream.

I wonder, though, how many violent and embittered people decide to link a political/religious message to their own private grudge against the world. My thoughts exactly, Bluecat.

It seems this was a disaffected, petty criminal who was persuaded to see himself as some kind of martyr by others with evil intent. Unfortunately there are too many of these pathetic individuals around.

I don't know the answer...

I'm so sad. I have had a lovely day out at Thomas Land for my little GS birthday, but as I watched my GC having a happy time, all I could think about were those poor little children and their families.

I want to wrap my family in my arms and protect them from the evil of this World.
But that just is not possible.

I agree, Morgana. These attacks seem mindless but presumably they do have a purpose - to foster rage and retaliation against the Muslim community which might, in turn, drive them into the arms of the extremists. Blaming all Muslims, or all migrants, plays straight into the hands of those who perpetrate these terrible deeds. I think that the contributors to this forum have more sense than to lump an entire community together and label them all as murderers, but unfortunately not everyone is so restrained. It is also true that international politics has played its part in radicalising people. God knows how much terrorism can be traced back to the war in Iraq.

As for this particular incident, the man seems to have been a petty criminal, though I suppose he might turn out to have terrorist links. I wonder, though, how many violent and embittered people decide to link a political/religious message to their own private grudge against the world.

Whatever his motivation, it was an appalling thing to do. Those poor, innocent people...and so many were children.

This is terrible news, but we need to start learning lessons: it is not all Muslims, it is the extreme 'radicalised' ones. Most religions at some time in their history have had such extreme factions and many thousands of people have been killed, supposedly in the name of religion. We need to work with Muslims, encourage them to speak out against the extremists - after all it is in their interest to do so, otherwise they will get 'tarred with the same brush'. We also need to learn not to interfere in other country's affairs. Think how many we killed in Iraq, Afghanistan, Syria - many of them innocent men, women and children. Our own hands are not clean. This is not to minimise the horror of the atrocity in France. Vive la France!

typo error callous, not calous

"Those who believe absurdities commit atrocities" Voltaire. His words resonate every time some piece of pond life takes it into his head to chant the hateful "Alahu Akbar"whilst taking the lives of innocent people and this time chldren and babies as well. Nothing great about this God. Such an awful calous act, yet another deeply tragic day for France.

Simply terrible. Full marks to France and its brave defiance.

You are kind!God bless you