A bad day for the world

I wouldn't fancy either of them but pushed nothing on earth would let me vote for Trump and everything he represents.
well, me neither whitewave but I do like to try to find out why people act/vote as they do

Of course he is dj, but like it or not he was saying what a lot of people wanted to hear it was as simple as that.

How many times did he go bankrupt? How many other people did he make bankrupt?

Watch out, America.

A bit like Theresa May, Tegan. The reason she can't tell anyone her ideas is because she hasn't got any.
Maybe he's just trying to look statesmanlike, like Obama. He's got a long way to go, and a lot of cartoons to live down.

He's probably just knackered, people like Trump never feel out of their depth. They don't know that they are out of their depth, or that they aren't understanding what they are being told.

We could try but I think it is going to be difficult

I've been out most of the day and only caught the tail end of the news, but does anyone else think that Trump looks a bit subdued and out of his depth? I like to think that he's thinking to himself 'what the hell of I done'.

d2axdqolvqmdvx.cloudfront.net/edbe0f05-e8d9-4da8-97ef-f7efa1cf62cb/MLKemail.jpg

Finding it hard to love Trump. Perhaps we can just ignore him instead.

It's just as if America wants to go back to the 50s in its attitude and values.

Are you saying, niggly, that Trump isn't smug and self-satisfied?

I bet Putin is laughing, knowing what Trump is like.

Luckylegs, I don't think anyone has ever brought it just down to race. However, I have given voting figures by race, and I think some US voters definitely voted against Trump because of his racist comments. Only 8% of African Americans voting for him?

54% of women voted for Clinton; 42% for Trump.
53% of men voted for Trump; 41% for Clinton.

The gender vote cancelled itself out.
Clinton had more people voting for her than Trump did, so I don't think you can blame her gender for the fact she lost.

If Boris had stood against May, who do you think would have won?
The reason she lost was because of the system, each state having a different number of votes in the electoral college.
She lost two states, Florida and Pennsylvania, by 1% 48% - 49%. Both those states had been going her way until the final few percent. It could have gone either way.
Florida has 29 electoral votes and Pennsylvania 20. If both those states had gone the other way, she would have won, so I don't think she has much to be sorry for.

Be careful,what you wish for * jalima* with regard to Trump and Putin. The thawing of the relationship will still mean that we have two authoritarian leaders in the world who believe in torture, are both likely to support Assad. Who are both keen to expand their military capability, who believe in nuclear proliferation. That NATO will be weakened, that Putin as a result will feel more able to throw his weight around in Europe.

It doesn't bode well

People when disillusioned will turn to someone however outrageous whom they believe will champion their cause and be sympathetic to their circumstances, not to mention cocking a snook at the smug self satisfied mixture as before. Ignore people whom you believe are intellectually your inferior and not worth consideration over a long period of time at your peril and don't be surprised if, like the French revolution, those same people, given the chance will turn on you with a vengeance.

Be afraid. Be very afraid.

jalima could be, but it still means that America has voted for an authoritarian reactionary as apposed to a liberal democrat

I wouldn't fancy either of them but pushed nothing on earth would let me vote for Trump and everything he represents.

Durhamjen, in response to your post in which you made reference to my comments. The point I was making that regardless of which party got in, it was through the Democratic process which I believe is preferable to a Dictatorship. Those protesting at the outcome of a fair election through the voting process are in fact protesting against Democracy which makes no sense at all. To bring all discussions down to race is ridiculous, people may be upset by unmonitored immigration but for example Brexit was for the majority if people that voted for it, a desire to manage our own laws, make our own decisions, fed up with Brussels over riding decisions made here, you may not agree with that, but that is what the Country wanted. In America they obviously had their own internal problems, it's a poor show that the best America would come up with was Trump and Clinton. We all know what Obama thinks of Trump, but he met him today with great dignity and intends to wifi with him.

Am I the only one who is hoping that there may be a thaw in the Russian/American relations for all our sakes?

act.wemove.eu/campaigns/hope-trumps-hate

whitewave Is the answer simply that Hillary lost because of the Clintons' previous sleaze, dodgy dealings, suspect activity relating to their 'charity'?
I am not referring to the emails and the FBI, rather their whole history from pre White House onwards.

And that she is not an icon for women - how ironic that many women chose to vote for the groping Trump than for Hillary? The fact that she either allowed Bill to do what he did and turned a blind eye - and in fact threatened women who spoke up!, may indicate that she was cynically using him to promote her own ambitions. Perhaps many women would have preferred her to have ditched Bill and carried on her career as a strong, independent woman.

I don't know, just musing, but the fact remains that Hillary does not come across as a 'woman's woman' could have gone against her.

Is it a fact that this is more that Hillary lost than Trump won?
The Democrats picked the wrong candidate.

I don't think there are many people like that petra most people are not that sure of anything really. Most of it involves hope mixed with fear. It is still upsetting though. When you think that America voted in someone who amongst other things believes in torture, admires Putin, rejects free trade, is a known misogynist, wants to build a wall against Americas neighbour and told a veteran who had been captured that he could not be considered a hero. This as well as untold other stuff.

What is upsetting are the implication of what may happen. I am sure we all fervently hope that none of it will happen. But we cannot be sure

Not to mention the result of the last UK GE. Some found that very difficult to accept...

I wonder what it feels like to be so sure of something, read up on every expert going, and then find you are soooooo wrong about the result of the two most important votes in recent history. That must hurt.

Yes nig I am sure that the working man has since the Great Recession, experienced austerity and ever greater inequality whilst watching the wealthy get even richer. Globalisation certainly has a lot to do with it and what is being described as the political elite ignoring what the worker is experiencing as unfairness.

It is easy to sneer at the democratic liberal, but we shouldn't forget that this brought us the post war contract that has served us well for 70 years.

Yes, durhamjen, it is, and I don't mind your patronising tone in the least...we're used to it!