An oath on British Values?

No thanks, Elegran. I once did a sociology course when there were only two of us, a very rightwinger and me.
We didn't agree on a thing, but the American lecturer enjoyed herself playing devil's advocate.

I may not agree with your opinions but uphold your right to voice them.

I must admit to being a bit concerned about Christianity being sidelined as it is, why can't we celebrate Christmas in some areas of UK, why was the cross removed from a crematorium,. Again I think this is down to the PC brigade and not necessarily down to complaints from other religious groups.

A similar recent paradox showed up in the States recently. Trump apparently said burning the American flag will be a crime. But then others retorted with this: Freedom in the US means that people are free to burn the flag.

Similarly, freedom of speech means that people are free to say that they disagree with thongs, even with laws. What they are not free to do is break the laws they disagree with. Well, to be exact, they are free to break laws but they have to accept the consequences of they do. That's what rule of law means.

But if enough people say they disagree with a law, then in a free culture, the law will eventually get changed. A recent example is the law on gay marriage.

*things !!

*if

Is there any area in the UK where we can't celebrate Christmas?

I was wondering that too, dj I don't remember it being made illegal to celebrate Christmas, or anyone being lynched for doing so.

www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/dec/02/digested-week-flag-and-lighter-solution-to-a-bureaucratic-nightmare

Which crematorium was that? I can understand that cremations may be of and by people who are of other faiths (or none) where a cross is not suitable, but it could surely be possible for a crematorium to have a removeable one, to be put up when requested and taken down again if not wanted. The turnover time between bookings is tight, but I imagine there is a tidy-up routine which could include cross deploying.

I like it, dj, bureaucracy defeated by its own hand.

Bath, Torbay, Accrington and others - quite a few if you Google it Elegran. Crosses have been permanently removed 'in case they offend those of other religions'.

(that was to the flag/lighter solution, have not studied the rest)

They should try seeking a compromise, then, instead of bowing to the lets-offend-one-religion-so-as-to-not-offend-another brigade.

I don't dare Google it, Ana, someone might accuse me of trying to look clever.

This isn't a recent thing, it's been happening for years and it's no wonder Christians are annoyed. I suppose they're expected to turn the other cheek...

So everyone gets a bare wall, with no focus point for anyone, whatever their faith. A solid hook at a suitable height, with a selection of plain cross, crucifix, star and crescent, star of David, and a few other things would cost very little and be phased in as wanted. If no religious symbol were specified when the booking was made, something neutral but universally suitable for the occasion could hang there.

They don't show much imagination, do they.

Oh, that would be far too difficult...just think if they got it wrong just once, it'd be on the National news!

Mmmmm yes, much safer to keep to the beige/grey nothingness option.

Apparently, the biggest growth in Christianity in the UK is amongst immigrant populations. I know that the tiny Catholic church in my town is standing room only since Poles arrived. About a third of the C of E church choir is of Nigerian heritage. As there are hardly any blacks from anywhere in this town, it must mean most of them are in the choir.

Yet, Islam is the fastest growing religion in the U.K.

When my husband was cremated, I never even noticed whether there was a cross or not. Wasn't really thinking about it.

Yes, Elegran, that was the one I expected people to look at.
I wonder if John Crace's wife will do that. I'm sure he'll let us know.

What do people think of the proliferation of 'Happy Holidays' instead of 'Happy Christmas'? I must say it really jars!

As there are hardly any blacks from anywhere in this town, it must mean most of them are in the choir.

Was that meant to be tongue-in-cheek daphnedill? It sounded rather a strange comment to make...

Why not remove the cross from a crematorium , how many being cremated are Christians?

Islam is the fastest growing faith and Christianity is the fastest faith in decline

brilliantmaps.com/wp-content/uploads/fastest-growing-religions.png

Not according to this map. It's folk/other.

I can't claim to be an expert on funerals, but I always thought a crematorium was for a secular funeral. If people want a religious ceremony, can't they have it in a church?

I went to a funeral a couple of years ago, where the service was in a church (Baptist) and then the coffin was taken off to the crematorium.

I've been looking at the insides of a few crematoria(?). Most still seem to have quite prominent crosses (which could be removed, I suppose), but I thought this one was quite tasteful in a secular way.