More gains for Libs

Hope Corbyn's not relying on the Libdems for support

www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/01/20/tim-farron-rules-lib-dem-labour-pact-toxic-jeremy-corbyn/

labourlist.org/2017/01/council-by-elections-labour-vote-share-increases-as-conservatives-hold/

Me neither.
But at least you say that you hope you are wrong varian which is more than some are.
T May isn't particularly right wing btw and won't be swayed by the press, she will do what she thinks and so far, so good.

I think you are wrong varian, but of course we'll have to agree to disagree as neither of us knows what's going to happen.

Tim Farron might be speaking for you, but he isn't speaking for me.

Tim Farron is standing up and saying what so many of us are thinking. He is not going to be cowed by the right wing press who seem to be directing Theresa May.

If she gets her way, and I expect she will, I think the UK will be sadly diminished - a once great country reduced to a shadow of what we were and could have been.

I have always been an optimist but I am not a "cock-eyed optimist". I think history will record this as an ill judged turn in the wrong direction. I hope I am wrong.

Farron is a joke.
May gave a brilliant speech today! The tone and content was exactly right, well done her.
niggly your hen comment made me laugh out loud.

'Theresa May.....has made the choice to do massive damage to the British economy. Has Farron got a crystal ball as well?

This is a theft of democracy Who on earth wrote his speech for him? Should get the sack, whoever it is!

We shall see!!! At least I'm not a perpetual prophet of doom!!

I think your crystal ball needs polishing.

You don't know any of that! You might believe it, but that won't make your vision come true. I believe you are quite delusional.

Tim Farron, when interviewed, sounded like a squawking indignant hen who had just been turfed off her nest!! speaking almost incoherent rubbish! People voted to leave the EU by whatever means necessary which included leaving the single market if needs must. The economy will not be massively damaged as this country will flourish without the constraints of the EU, making the most of the fact that there is a world out there beyond continental Europe. I'm even more full of optimism after hearing Mrs May's speech which was fantastic. Bring it on !!

Sorry if the link is wrong.

Tim Farron said: 'Theresa May has confirmed Britain is heading for a Hard Brexit. She claimed people voted to Leave the Single Market. They didn't. She has made the choice to do massive damage to the British economy. Theresa May also made clear that she will deny the people a vote on the final deal. So instead of a democratic decision by the people in the country, she wants a stitch-up by politicians in Westminster. The people voted for departure, they should be given a vote on the destination. This is a theft of democracy.'

Tim Farron's comments on Theresa May's speech

www.google.co.uk/search?q=tim+farron&oq=tim&aqs=chrome.0.69i59j69i57j0l4.2310j0j7&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8

Several of my friends who voted Remain in 1975 have said that thy voted to join the Common Market and did not vote for an ever-closer Union

Absolutely.

And trying to rewrite history while people are still alive is silly behaviour and futile.

Before I get jumped on, I should not have said: In common with Tony Benn, Jeremy Corbyn and 33% of those voting, I voted leave for reasons of sovereignty.

Of course, I have no idea why 33% of people voted OUT in 1975, just as we have little idea why voters voted the way they did in 2016. I do know why I voted. I voted to leave the EU because I believe the EU is too centralised, too bureaucratic, too undemocratic and likely to fail, economically and ultimately politically. It needs reform but, like the lady, the EU seems not for turning.

The UK joined the EEC in 1973 after Parliament, under the Heath Government voted the UK IN. In 1975, under the Wilson Government, the Referendum vote was to stay IN or come OUT. In common with Tony Benn, Jeremy Corbyn and 33% of those voting, I voted leave for reasons of sovereignty.

Several of my friends who voted Remain in 1975 have said that thy voted to join the Common Market and did not vote for an ever-closer Union. They voted Leave in 2016, as did I. As I have said before, we are not stupid or racist; and we were not duped in 2016. We did not swallow all the Leave propaganda any more than we swallowed all the Remain threats. Some of the worst predictions have already proved wrong and while nobody can judge the future, so far not so bad.

It remains to be seen how the EU will do without the UK. The Eurozone has not performed well to date. I have heard it described as a 3 legged table because a monetary union without some centralised fiscal and banking control is unlikely to survive. The vocal Remainers seem unwilling to discuss the weaknesses in the EU.

Tim Farron might have proved his leadership quality in the debate on the Referendum Bill by clarifying just what the Referendum meant and by requiring the Government to prepare for either outcome. Personally, I find him profoundly unconvincing.

No, we didn't need a referendum to get us into the Common Market. We had a referendum to stay in.

rosesarered

There was a pretty disgraceful Remain campaign as well.

Quite. One of the worst bits for me was the action of David Cameron and what the civil servants were allowed to do and not allowed to do.
I was never his biggest fan to begin with.

Very true Ankers not only ad infinitum but ad nauseam!

Thank you MaizieD

I tried googling but gave up. The list would be so enormous!

Last year's referendum was only advisory -
So was Scotland's?

So was the 1973 referendum?

a snapshot of opinion on a single day
So was the 1973 one. And the Scottish one. That is what referendums are.

37% of the electorate were duped by the liescof the disgraceful Leave campaign.

Cant be bothered to discuss that. It has been discussed ad infitum on gransnet already.

I don't think that Farron is a strong leader at all.But even if he was, I don't happen to agree about Brexit.It doesn't matter how many times a poster says the referendum was 'only advisory' .....the result was always going to be upheld, and it certainly will be.
There was a pretty disgraceful Remain campaign as well.
We needed a referendum to get us into the 'common market' and we needed a referendum to take us out of the EU.Roll on triggering article 50!

Last year's referendum was only advisory - a snapshot of opinion on a single day when 37% of the electorate were duped by the liescof the disgraceful Leave campaign.

We are supposed to live in a representative democracy where political decisions are made by our elected politicians. If only they had the courage of their convictions and were prepared to chuck out brexit and not be bullied by the right wing press with their threats of mob rule

Unfortunately it looks as if most MPs , no matter what they know and believe, are likely to follow Theresa May's lead and cave in to the brexiteers.

Tim Farron is a strong leader, not just for the LibDems, but for a big section of the population who understand the many advantages of remaining in the EU. His policy of having a second referendum after the terms are known iis eminently sensible and could save us from buying a pig in a poke.

I will google sometime how many rules and regulations have been added since it came into existence.

This takes a slightly different angle but you might find it interesting, Ankers.

Bear in mind that regulations relating to standards of traded goods and services would be necessary whether we were trading with the EU bloc or other countries. One would hope that the UK would not accept the importation of goods which didn't meet our standards, or vice versa.

www.jcm.org.uk/blog/2009/06/what-percentage-of-laws-come-from-the-eu/

I can't follow what Tim Farron says on the Free Movement of People/Single Market position.

It's like Corbyn's has no affirmative position.

I have tried but every interview I watch he contradicts himself.

I really do think he is 'the nicest political leader', certainly not Corbyn who is given the presumed title but I
genuinely wish I could take him seriously.

A "ruse"?