Martin McGuinness

IMO he was a man of 2 parts and I feel both parts should be acknowledged, not just one - both had huge impacts.

As someone who lived in Belfast through the worst of 'the troubles', I too am ambivalent about the death of Martin McGuiness.

When it all kicked off, I was a student and avid supporter of 'one man (sic), one vote'. Only fair in what should have been a democratic society. Catholics were definitely discriminated against in many ways. However, the IRA had another agenda and that was a United Ireland separate from U.K. I am not averse to that either. In process of applying for my Irish passport to remain an EU citizen.

At the time, they chose to roll out this agenda by random and widespread acts of horrendous violence on innocent civilians. Bombs were planted in the early days mainly in the centre of Belfast without any warning almost every day at one point. The city centre was decimated. Men, women and children were killed and seriously maimed. And like you, Coolgran I had several near misses. Some of my acquaintances were not so lucky. Inevitably, it turned into even more horrendous tit for tat civil war.

And Martin McGuiness, Gerry Adams and Gerry Kelly were involved in this. Hardly surprising then that people who lived through this and suffered, are finding it difficult to forget. And Anniebach I know all about the 'freedom fighter' argument. But IMO no one has any right to take the life of another just for idealistic reasons. Not then, not now.

On the other hand, I admired M McG for his strength of character in working for the Peace Process and following through on the agreement. Our current 'politicians' need to emulate them and stop their petty backbiting. So yes I do find it difficult to forget the past. But acknowledge the turnabout he made to bring N Ireland out of the awful mess it was in. The world could do with more of that.

I too have a paternal Irish g.grandmother who came from County Cork. Her father was a Weaver and she came to England for whatever reason, I guess financial, married an Englishman and the rest is history, so I do have sympathy with how atrociously the Irish were treated by England over many centuries, and how disgracefully Catholics were treated in NI. BUT nothing on this earth justified the violence meeted out by both sides of the divide,whatever the reason and however sincerely felt. To obtain peace and cooperation both sides had to sup with their particular devil which to their credit they did, and I hope that both Martin McGuiness and Iain Paisley (the chuckle brothers!!) find peace with God.

Sitting outside and having no Irish connections at all, both sides seemed as appalling as each other - and the extremists still do. I understand how those involved much more intimately than I have such strong views on Martin McGuiness. But to me, I see two men, Martin McGuineess and Ian Paisley, who started by loathing each other and what they stood for, and had the strength of character to overcome the hatred to become good friends working for peace, and able to show the world that whatever the starting point there is an opportunity for reconciliation in the most unexpected places.

God works in mysterious ways!!

Degradation and discrimination by Protestants against Catholics has been rife for centuries. That does not make it right and is not what the IRA were hoping to eradicate. In many ways the sectarianism played into the hands of the IRA in their aim to have a United Ireland. Martin McGuinness was a young man brought up on the 'fire in the belly' politics of the time and it was no surprise he originally got involved in civil rights protests. However, he was a determined and clear-headed individual and although he was promoted within the ranks of the IRA he could see that murders and bombings were not going to achieve anything but retaliation and hatred from Northern Ireland itself and mainland Britain, who sent in the army.

Many people on both sides questioned his honesty and intentions when he moved into politics and, with his past history, it was a brave thing to do. He worked hard in the peace negotiations and deserves respect for his work in getting the DUP to work with Sinn Fein at Stormont. RIP Mr McGuinness

No R.I.P. from me. He was responsible for too many deaths, some of them he carried out himself probably. And he did very nicely out of the peace process

Blair fell over backwards to pander to the IRA, and other terrorist organisations, even when the tide had turned against them. Now we have the situation in Birmingham where the perpetrators of the Birmingham bombings are known but unable TP be prosecuted because of his ridiculous amnesty. Twenty-one dead and no one brought to justice.

For very personal reasons I agree with grey duster, not sure I can forgive his history.

Norman Tebbit hit the nail on the head. I can't remember his actual comment but it was along the lines of the world being a sweeter place without him and that Hell has a place for him, now. I know I've got the wording wrong, but I do agree.
The out and out cruelty of this man and his followers beggars belief.
I hope he never rests in peace. Ever.

Norman Tebbit is a disgruntled Conservative who resented the peace protest. The Conservative's record on dealing with the IRA was appalling and ineffective. Anyone remember the ridiculous policy on not allowing their voices to be heard? It did lead to a number of hilarious comedy skits. Terrorism arises when governments fail to listen to the complaints of a group of its citizens, in NI the catholics in South Africa black Africans. Moving from terrorism to statesmanship is the real mark of the man and Martin McGuiness did this. So before you simply condemn him for his activities with the IRA ask yourself where would we be if he had not worked for peace and how many more people would be dead?
Personally I recognise the complaints that catholics had in NI and the reluctance of successive governments to deal with these. What was a peaceful civil rights movement was escalated into violence by their actions.

Norman Tebbit is a man whose wife was left paralysed by an IRA bomb ?

It's perfectly understandable for Norman Tebbit to feel the way he does and I don't think there is anything disgruntled at all in his attitude. To see one's beloved spouse paralysed for the rest of her life from the neck downwards through the actions of terrorism must be very hard indeed and impossible to reconcile. I don't agree with wishing Martin McG to eternal damnation, but I can understand it.

Politics aside, Norman Tebbit's feelings are personal because as Anya has said his wife was left paralysed when the IRA bombed the hotel in Brighton where they were staying during a Conservative Party Conference. Hand on heart who could say they would not hate those who had inflicted such a violent act on a person they loved.

Tebbit's feelings about McGuiness are understandable, rubbishing the peace process was unnecessary. Such language and rhetoric doesn't help and actually creates conflict.

So, let me get this right, some of you are saying that because others behaved in an atrocious way in the past. M McG was quite justified in killing?
Surely no one believes that.

I think I said the exact opposite!

You would think not wouldn't you Pamela but apparently some do believe that.

trisher says....' Norman Tebbit is a disgruntled Conservative ' am afraid trisher that is the kind of remark that does you no favours, in fact, it's disgraceful of you.

I can't see what on earth Norman Tebbit's politics has to do with it. Surely he'd be just as angry and embittered if he and his wife were working in the hotel that night and nothing to do with the conference.

Colin Parry, father of Tim Parry, killed by the Warrington IRA bomb said , on learning of McGuiness's death: " I can't forgive him, but I can respect the man he became." Eloquent and poignant. I agree with Mr. Parry's form of humanity.

He could perfectly well have expressed his feelings about McGuiness without making reference to the peace process rosesarered. He chose not to do so, but to say that it was unnecessary and the IRA was infiltrated and would have been defeated anyway. Saying such things is quite likely to feed division and create conflict at a time when things in NI are unstable. Why would he do such a thing? Disgruntled is the only reason I can imagine. If you have another explanation for his saying such things I am willing to listen.

Exactly Merlot...... it's as if Conservatives are considered fair game for any atrocity.

I do not think that Mandela could be described as a terrorist; but McGuiness definitely falls into that category.

Unfortunately you cannot stop a war without negotiating with some very unpleasant people; but I was never sure that going on to put these people in positions of power and responsibility was the right move.

History tells us that the Irish Catholics had had a raw deal - but I find it hard to see that as an excuse for masterminding he wholesale slaughter of innocent people.

I too walked out of a Birmingham shop and it blew up behind me - I could have finished up as an IRA statistic but for a few moments.

I find it hard to mourn his death.

You chose not to say ' a disgruntled man' ( plenty to be disgruntled about) but 'a disgruntled Conservative', says it all really.You would never have said ' a disgruntled Labour ' etc.He was very likely right anyway about the IRA, they knew they weren't getting anywhere and there were divsions and falling outs amongst themselves.
Wouldn't it be nice if some posters left party politics out of some posts and had a bit of that overused word ( but in this case needed) compassion.

Nobody has accused any Conservative of any "atrocity" rar simply of ill considered and unhelpful comments. I await your reason for his rubbishing the agreement which has brought peace to NI.