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Should I vote SNP?

(85 Posts)
Granny23 Fri 12-May-17 12:39:34

Given that the Labour vote has collapsed in Scotland this GE has become a straight fight between the SNP and the Conservatives, many former, often life long, Labour supporters find themselves between a rock and a hard place. Should they swallow their long standing anathema to the SNP, Labour's major competitors for votes for the last 20 odd years or do the previously unthinkable and vote Conservative.

The Tories appear to be basing their campaign in Scotland entirely on their opposition to a second referendum, giving no firm promises or concrete plans for anything to Scotlan's advantage e.g. support for the Fishing Industry post Brexit or lowering the iniquitous charges for putting power generated in Scotland on to the grid.

Meanwhile the SNP are concentrating on providing a left of centre, powerful voice for Scotland (and the vulnerable across the UK) e,g, leading the struggle for the WASPI women, attacking the 2 child/rape Clause legislation, in a hostile hard right Westminster.

What should socialist or centre left voters do? Vote Tory to protect the Union, or SNP whose policies are more in tune with their own priorities?

paddyann Fri 26-May-17 11:39:32

can it be pointed out that the European education authority has saiid Scotland is the BEST educated country in Europe ....yes there are blips but tell me which country or government doesn't have those ? Our police are still at the same levels they were at BEFORE austerity and in England there have been tens of thousands axed ..hence the need for troop on the streets over 95% satisfaction with the NHS in Scotland ,42% drop in crime ,mitigated the bedroom tax ,still provides FREE personal care for the elderly and much more...it is a very impressive record for a government who have had their budget cut yearly .Look at the rest of the UK and how they have suffered under first the coalition and now the tories and tell me we haven't been shielded from the worst

paddyann Fri 26-May-17 11:39:33

can it be pointed out that the European education authority has saiid Scotland is the BEST educated country in Europe ....yes there are blips but tell me which country or government doesn't have those ? Our police are still at the same levels they were at BEFORE austerity and in England there have been tens of thousands axed ..hence the need for troop on the streets over 95% satisfaction with the NHS in Scotland ,42% drop in crime ,mitigated the bedroom tax ,still provides FREE personal care for the elderly and much more...it is a very impressive record for a government who have had their budget cut yearly .Look at the rest of the UK and how they have suffered under first the coalition and now the tories and tell me we haven't been shielded from the worst

paddyann Fri 26-May-17 11:39:33

can it be pointed out that the European education authority has saiid Scotland is the BEST educated country in Europe ....yes there are blips but tell me which country or government doesn't have those ? Our police are still at the same levels they were at BEFORE austerity and in England there have been tens of thousands axed ..hence the need for troop on the streets over 95% satisfaction with the NHS in Scotland ,42% drop in crime ,mitigated the bedroom tax ,still provides FREE personal care for the elderly and much more...it is a very impressive record for a government who have had their budget cut yearly .Look at the rest of the UK and how they have suffered under first the coalition and now the tories and tell me we haven't been shielded from the worst

paddyann Fri 26-May-17 11:39:33

can it be pointed out that the European education authority has saiid Scotland is the BEST educated country in Europe ....yes there are blips but tell me which country or government doesn't have those ? Our police are still at the same levels they were at BEFORE austerity and in England there have been tens of thousands axed ..hence the need for troop on the streets over 95% satisfaction with the NHS in Scotland ,42% drop in crime ,mitigated the bedroom tax ,still provides FREE personal care for the elderly and much more...it is a very impressive record for a government who have had their budget cut yearly .Look at the rest of the UK and how they have suffered under first the coalition and now the tories and tell me we haven't been shielded from the worst

POGS Fri 26-May-17 11:59:59

Granny 23

We agree on something.

You did indeed start your thread in a manner that denotes the OP is asking a personal question but that was not the case.

Jane10 Fri 26-May-17 12:23:13

Check the PISA study paddyann. It was the internationally recognised study that found Scottish educational attainment had plummeted over the last 10 years. Even your Nicola Sturgeon has admitted this.

Granny23 Fri 26-May-17 13:08:24

Bearing in mind that this is a UK General Election and therefore nothing to do with Scottish Government e.g. not one of the Scottish Party Leaders is a candidate in this election and it is NOT a vote for or against Independence, can I ask, politely, once again for someone, anyone, to tell us what is on offer from the other Parties which will be of benefit to those who live in Scotland. I doubt very much that either PaddyAnne or I will change our minds but there are others who are swithering who could use some factual information, not sound bites, to help them decide who to vote for.

I am beginning to think that the wall of silence indicates that there IS NOTHING positive to report.

Jane10 Fri 26-May-17 15:10:36

Or lack of interest in SNP viewpoint?

FarNorth Fri 26-May-17 18:56:29

Granny23 didn't ask for anyone to show an interest in SNP viewpoint. She asked for factual information on the other parties and what they are offering to Scotland that would lead people to vote for them rather than SNP.

Jane10 Fri 26-May-17 19:10:27

What I should have expressed more clearly is that many people see 'SNP' and just move on without reading further.

grannypiper Sat 27-May-17 16:33:41

I have just returned from a village Gala day and the bloody snp even have a stall there touting for business. Cnat they give anyone peace ?

FarNorth Sat 27-May-17 20:37:00

Were they shouting or trying to drag you to the stall, grannypiper?
How did they disrupt your peace?

Jalima1108 Sat 27-May-17 20:43:16

Everywhere like a rash as DH would say grin grannypiper

grannypiper Sun 28-May-17 08:29:30

FARNORTH No shouting but trying to shove unwanted ballons and leaflets into your hand.I took great delight in telling them i was voting Tory (havent decided who to vote for), more than one person told them the same.
No doubt photos will appear on social media with families laughing and smiling on a lovey sunny day with the children holding snp ballons so it looks like they support this party, great propaganda !

Jane10 Sun 28-May-17 08:53:21

They were in trouble the other day when they were reported to be following Tory canvassers and drowning out what they were trying to say.
No surprises there!

FarNorth Sun 28-May-17 09:48:39

One person, only, was doing that.

Those particular Tory canvassers were out in the streets when campaigning was supposed to be suspended.

Jane10 Sun 28-May-17 09:55:27

So somehow following people in a van with a loudhailer isn't canvassing either? That sort of SNP harassment only serves to put people off them even more. I don't think they realise how counterproductive that is. Fair enough. Let them keep shooting theymselves in the feet.

FarNorth Sun 28-May-17 10:20:37

Not "they" - one person did that and of course it was a stupid thing to do.
It was not canvassing by "the SNP"

Those Conservatives were definitely canvassing when they should not have been and have probably ended up with feet full of buckshot because of it.

Jane10 Sun 28-May-17 11:04:17

It wasn't just one. The video was widely shared on the net.

FarNorth Sun 28-May-17 12:39:01

Yes, I saw it.

I expect the person was angry to see a group of Conservatives campaigning illegally.

varian Mon 29-May-17 08:58:13

Yet again Nicola Sturgeon is doing her utmost to ensure that the UK elects a Tory government. She is saying she would try to work with Labour, knowing full well that when she made that triumphalist statement in the last week of the 2015 election campaign it provoked a huge pro-Tory reaction right across England
giving the dirty tricks department of the Tory party the ammunition they needed to take LibDem and Labour seats and gain an undeserved majority.

Clearly the SNP want another Tory government and know that their offer to support Corbyn is likely to bring that about.

varian Mon 29-May-17 12:57:06

In an interview with the BBC, SNP leader Nicola Sturgeon told Andrew Neil that she would work with Labour leader Jeremy Corbyn in a hung parliament though she doesn't consider him a "credible alternative" as Prime Minister.

In other words, she prefers having Theresa May, who she obviously judges to be more credible, and she knows that saying she would work with Corbyn will help elect a Tory government, just as it did in 2015.

Having a Tory government suits the SNP separatists agenda of non-stop whinging for another neverendum. A Labour government would give them less to complain about.

HildaW Mon 29-May-17 13:10:28

Its odd....I'm English (British) whatever....I've lived in the south of England all my life and have no family connections with Scotland and would loathe it if Scotland left us (hells teef we need all the friends we can get) BUT every time I hear an SNP politician talk they seem to make so much more sense!!! Really not sure which way to go.

varian Mon 29-May-17 13:21:05

I am Scottish and British and have lived in different parts of the UK and abroad. I have seen the damage done by the nationalists, not just in Scotland, but the knock on effects for the whole country.

I agree that some SNP politicians are good speakers. I also agree with some of their policies, for instance their opposition to brexit but I am totally opposed to their core aim of separatism.

They can talk the talk, and take in quite a lot of people in the process. That is what makes them a real danger to the survival of our country.

Granny23 Mon 29-May-17 17:37:13

Varian You are putting words,conjured up by your own fears, into Nichola's mouth. All she has said is that she would work with Labour or other Parties where their manifesto commitments coincide. People are not as stupid as you seem to think and as Hilda has noticed, mull over statements and come to their own conclusion that they are hearing common sense or bullshit. Almost of the SNP MSPs and MPs have had careers in the real world before being elected and I think that shows in their sensible 'take' on issues when compared to MPs who have gone straight from University into the Westminster bubble as interns, protegees.

Just back from a wonderful weekend at the Strathyre Music Festival and checked the thread for pearls of wisdom and positive reasons to vote Tory, Labour or Liberal in Scotland but still Zilch. So here's an easier question:

Why is someone who wants Scotland to govern itself and be an Independent Country a 'separatist' while those who want to separate from the EU, taking back Sovereignty' are not?