Democracy hahahaha

If you look back in history you will notice everything the Tories do has dire consequences long-term. They sell off all the large mental hospitals hence mentally ill patients are in prison or police station cells NOT because they are criminals but because of the lack of hospital beds. They sold off council houses cheap and kept the money so councils could not build new houses hence housing crisis.The list is endless... They can not even manage to hold a general election without making the UK unstable and the laughing stock of the world. With all their cuts cuts and more cuts how have any of us benefited from them? Incredibly they have even turned street lights off at night whilst at the same time reduced the police by 20,000. Mrs May said before the election that she wants to implement the Naylor report whereby she wants to sell off all NHS land and buildings to private developers cheaply!!!!

Exactly, Gardenman!

Things like this cannot be said too often. Perhaps one day they'll actually go in and people will realise how everything we've taken for granted has been stolen from us...

I think a lot of decisions made by politicians of all parties have dire consequences beyond anything that their brains can imagine.

There has been plenty of time to build more council houses, build more hospitals etc etc but there has not been the will.
However, you can't re-write history and take back two wars with far-reaching disastrous consequences.

I for one am dependent on the NHS for treatment and my health is not great.....

Am I right in thinking that there are still restrictions on the number of council houses that can be built?

Incredibly they have even turned street lights off at night

but that is not just to save money but also to save energy in order to meet carbon emission targets
the Campaign to Protect Rural England has previously called for more councils to dim lights to "reduce the impact of light pollution.
They are not turned off in potential crime areas.

Councils are installing low energy, low light polluting street lighting as much as possible too.

However, it would be useful if they turned them off during the day in some areas!

I feel hopeful that there may be Tories who won't stay with her and DUP and make her gov even worse off
Strong and stable my arse

This election is a clear demonstration of how democracy can work well; so all those complaining about it (democracy)and the naysayers can stop moaning and analyse the results. There is one significant matter that ought to concern us: the growing divide between young and old.

Jeremy Corbyn has got a huge number of younger voters who are in it for the first time. These are the least knowledgable about finance, economics, law, international relations, diplomacy and most importantly our sovereign debt. That debt has been increasing ever since the financial crisis.

We are still some way from a fiscal balance year on year. Spend even more on tick? With interest rates so low it is still a huge sum to cover each year so what will happen when interest rates rise? If we have not by then brought our national finances into a better position the austerity we have had so far will look like an easy life compared to what we could be facing.

This election was wholly unnecessary. May has let everyone down. We are now in a period of uncertainty. Just when we do need a period of stability; how ironic is that?

I'm inclined to think that people's welfare is vastly more important than money

Sorry, CardiffJaguar, but isn't that naysaying?

Well said Gardenman, well said.

I am so pleased that the kids turned out to vote, they can see that if they vote they can help to steer the ship in a different direction.

We certainly live in interesting times!

Alive people's welfare is entirely dependant on money! I think that was Cardiff's point.

Sorry - "Alie"!

I haven't seen much evidence that over 65s know much about finances, economics or sovereign debt.

I've got a good idea. Freeze the state pension and stop winter fuel allowance, etc. Charge pensioners for prescriptions and cap the amount they can cost the NHS. If they don't have any money they'll die younger anyway.

That would bring the deficit down in no time! Pensions, pensioner benefits and pensioner use of the NHS costs billions - much more than abolishing tuition fees and giving every child in the country a free school meal.

Before anybody shouts at me, I'm not serious, but can people seriously not see the irony of moaning about young people voting for a manifesto which might benefit them?

Oh! And grab their houses (hopefully after they've died) and give them to the homeless. Sorted!

We are still some way from a fiscal balance year on year.

That sounds really impressive, CardiffJaguar but what does it actually mean?

DD, the problem with democracy is exactly as you say - everyone gets the chance to vote for their own selfish reasons. Those with money want to keep it. Those without it want the others to hand it over. There's no irony in one group moaning about the other as far as I can see. Just inevitability. What's important is who is right - and to my mind "right" means an economic structure which collects as much tax as possible on a sustainable long term basis and spends the money in a manner to benefit as many as possible. Not in the forefront of most voters minds, I think.

dd @ 18.57

I agree.

I think this condescending attitude towards the lack of experience of 'the young' is ridiculous. They can be just as wll informed as older people. What is more, it's a tad hypocritical. I doubt very much if we would have liked to be told we knew nothing when we were young voters

I thought you were bowing out for a couple of
days, Fitzy

What's important is who is right - and to my mind "right" means an economic structure which collects as much tax as possible on a sustainable long term basis and spends the money in a manner to benefit as many as possible.

But you seem to be missing out the circular nature of the flow of money. The state collects money through tax, to be spent on public 'goods' but, in the act of spending it, a great deal comes back to the state in the form of tax; either taxes on income or taxes on the profits of businesses supplying the needs of the wage earners or the needs of the services the state is providing (e.g books for schools, drugs for hospitals, raw materials for road building etc.)

Not in the forefront of most voters minds, I think.

I know that here you were referring to the state spending money for the benefit of as many as possible, but I'd also suggest that the fact that money circulates is also not in the forefront of most voters' minds. They seem to think that money government spends is poured into a bottomless pit and is never seen again.

A lot of Tories are feeling very queasy about the mysogist gay hating ultra conservative and reactionary DUP holding the Tory party by the whatsonames

I think that many young people are very well informed and in many cases more so than those older people who get their information from the likes of the Daily Fail. Sun and Express. They research more as they are very au fait with the Internet .
The front pages of the Mail and Sun yesterday were an absolute disgrace besides being all lies- maybe they should be sued for Libel.! That is no way to be interacting with the public about politics. Most things are open to interpretation but blatant lying is not the way to go - most of it done by people who are using those who do not realise the implications to vote in a Govt which will help them pay less tax and benefit in other ways.

Durhamjen: why? How? Maybe we start from the wrong end.

This is indeed not democracy - it is a total disgrace. Even conservative voters cannot have foreseen the whole country being held to ransom by the DUP. They hold all the power - 10 people determining the direction of our laws by manipulating the "government." It is dreadful.