Could we not separate news and politics?

Of course I would want answers suzied but I would want the right answers not silly assumptions from people with their own agendas .

maizie I used it quite deliberately!! I have a long memory.

voxpoliticalonline.com/2017/06/15/the-next-grenfell-tower-style-disaster-could-happen-in-your-local-school/

Why are such inflammable materials allowed to be used in homes - particularly in buildings like difficult to reach tower blocks? Fire retardant materials are available and would possibly have given people longer to get out safely.
The person who told people to stay in the flats and wait to be rescued must be feeling dreadful today.

gillybob According to reports, the fire services arrived 6 minutes after the alarm was raised and, within that time, the fire had ignited, "like paper" according to one witness, right up the side and to the top of the tower block. If that had happened in a developing country, the story would focus on poor regulation and corruption. It is absolutely obvious that something is wrong - either the fire/building regulations are not fit for purpose or those regulations were disregarded.

I, for one, had no idea that fire platforms and water hoses could only reach to 12 floors. Surely this is madness?

I heard that they only reach that far because they are supposed to be able to fight the fire from inside and have fire hydrant points on all the landings

I do not think you can ask for (and get) gentle politics. It happens occasionally when there is a consensus but as we all know, like religion things tend to get heated.

I believe this is because both are a reflection of our view of morality and this is about our intrinsic self. On here we see people try and rubbish another view because it seems to make them feel uncomfortable and that leads to them trying to stop the discussion.

Personally, I will not put my politics (not rooted in any party) behind me to make someone else feel their stance is reasonable although I am happy to hear their argument that it is, nor will I stop believing that poverty is a moral problem; that the rights of the poor should be the same as the rights of the rich. When anyone says 'let's not talk about blame' I, personally, feel they are saying 'let's not talk about people's rights to live safely'. 'Let's not talk about' always seems to deny someone their right to be heard - not us but those suffering. I would agree we should not apportion blame until it has been properly investigated but we should certainly be allowed to discuss what is being discussed by those involved.

What is meant by saying we should not be political?. Is this the same as the feeling those people in the flats got when they questioned what was being done to them. They have said they felt they were seen as trouble-makers perhaps they were even seen as taking part in political wrangling. Morality is politics. No one party owns the moral high ground but taking a moral stance is a choice and finding out what that should be has to be discussed.

The one thing we have seen as part of the aftermath of this tragedy is the outpouring of love and the coming together of all communities. That is the greatest political and moral stance we can hope for not the closing down of free speech suggested here.

Yes I heard that on radio 4 this morning Eloethan and Rigby46

Thank goodness some people ignored the instructions to stay inside their flats. But those poor people who did what they were told to do...

There is a limit to the height that water can effectively be pumped. That may be the reason.
www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/explainer/2004/12/how_high_can_a_fire_hose_shoot.html

"^Between 75 feet and 100 feet straight up, depending on water pressure. In practice, though, firefighters on the ground rarely attempt to reach higher than 40 feet with hoses. Since water pushes smoke and heat back into the building, attacking a high-rise blaze from the outside can actually be counterproductive. That's especially true if there's a chance people may still be trapped inside.^

Firefighters can also use truck-borne ladders to reach high places, but scaling a ladder with a heavy hose is often difficult. The general rule of thumb is that ladder-and-hose setups are only effective up to about the 10th floor; after that, it's imperative that the blaze either be fought from an adjoining structure, such as the Chicago building's roof wings, or from the inside.

^The most common approach in high-rises, then, is to use a building's standpipe system. This consists of an interior vertical pipe that runs from the ground to the roof, allowing firefighters to connect hoses on any floor. The water usually comes from either a fire truck or a street-level hydrant; firefighters connect a hose from the water source to a standpipe outlet, and it's then pumped upward to the blaze's location.^"

Something went wrong with the ^^s in my previous post.