EU wants us to pay 89 BILLION divorce charges.

I'm baffled, too, counterpoint. Walking away with no deal is pointing a gun at our own head and saying 'If you don't co-operate with my demands I'll shoot myself'

People have, from time to time on other threads, tried to point out what a 'no deal' would look like or link to informed commentators who spell it out, but all to no avail. Leavers just don't believe it.

Nezumi65 My DD is an academic. She knows better than I do what the implications are for university research. She was not at all happy about the Leave vote. But perhaps you could explain a bit more for the benefit of us non-academics.

trisher. Yes I raised the sad situation of a child who died as a result of a failure to receive medical care whilst living in the EU. Should such an appalling situation be swept under the rug because referring to it will be callously described as 'using it'.

It is callous to use this example, as Alan Kurdi, who is the boy I assume you mean, did not die as a result of not receiving medical care in the EU.
He never reached the EU. He died on a Turkish beach.

What did you expect? They wanted us to join in the first place (despite the seeming negatives on their side) and have been very happy to take our money ever since. When we leave they will be sorry and looking elsewhere for similar funds. So now they are trying to penalise us for leaving. So much for any fairness in the negotiations.

What do you think they used 'our money' for, CardiffJaguar?

What would you have wanted them to use 'our money for'?

Jaycee I made 5 points in that post and only one - the second was addressed to you.

Petra was the BBC figure all students or specifically EU ones? I had not seen that - but I know that a high proportion are not repaid as the people concerned do not earn enough within the time period to repay the loan.

UK students in EU universities go to them under the same conditions as the citizens of the individual nations - most of whom have lower fees than Uk or none at all.

It is callous to use this example, as Alan Kurdi, who is the boy I assume you mean, did not die as a result of not receiving medical care in the EU.

Oh, I assumed that Jaycee was talking about another child at another time. I suppose a link to the occurrence would have been helpful.

Welshwife, both my daughters in law took degrees in the UK, and both of them had fees paid by their countries of origin, so you are right. They also had grants for living on, just as many of us did.

The only five year old I have heard about, Maizie, was Alan Kurdi's brother who was washed up further up the beach. Alan Kurdi was only three, so you are right, it probably wasn't him.

May I gently equire do we also get our portion of the 'family home' ie the portfolio of property our money contributed to building over the years in our divorce settlement. It seems no discussion outside of what we owe? As a major contributor to EU funds (and yes benefits have helped our economy) the thought of a federal militia and sending our young men and women to possible war without our own government (accountable to the people) saying when, where or how or more importantly WHY?but through the whim of an unelected President of Europe (probably German or French) is unacceptable to me, as is the erosion of our national identity. Please can we keep discussion reasonable and civil no matter how passionately we feel about either side on this forum which has been so amusing, supportive and educational. I do feel I have a wide group of friends though have never met any of you yet.

A good post Peachesand I totally agree.?

Try and do the local meet ups btw then you can meet other GNers.?

I have now decided to take the long view on Europe in that it has been a matter of debate for over 2,000 years. On balance we have always gone for independence and the open sea in the end.
And yes, no deal should be on the cards but only if absolutely necessary.

peaches we do have quite a few “assists” sitting in the U.K.

I can give you lots of examples

Flood defence is one - many of the large scale projects have only been started/completed because of EU funding
Bodmin bypass recently completed as a result of EU money.
Money directly paid to areas seen as needing an economic boost such as Hastings, Wales etc
Farmers get funding for various projects
Funding for various charities
Funding for deprived areas.

I am sure that every single person on here can point to projects completed as a result of EU funding.

And most of all is the fact that our economy benefited hugely from the single market as businesses will testify.

cardiff I have to point out your seemingly rewriting of history.

The UKs economy throughout the 50 and 60s was growing far slower than those members of the single market, we were known as the sick man of Europe. Consequently we applied and was turned a number of times to become a member of the single market. Eventually the EU caved in and we were accepted as a member of the club agreeing as one does to the rules in order to belong to the club.
The existing common market member, particularly the French were always luke warm over our membership.

If we do go for a portion of projects done over the years by the EU what will we do with the newly completed Heads of the Valley Road and colleges in Wales and other projects paid for by the EU in Britain.

There is no European army being planned - if you read what the Europeans say it is closer co operation and there would still be no actual army - the detail is what matters - NATO does the troops part and has done for years. I cannot give you a link as I think I heard the speeches at the EU Parliament itself.

Everyone was entitled to vote how they wish and many of those who voted to leave have not changed their mind - but could I ask if any of you are at all worried about the job losses and companies already making plans to move away from UK because it is leaving the EU? Personally I am worried sick about it-obviously not for ourselves -but for the younger members of the nation.

It may well sort itself out in a few years but what about the youngsters at the age now iof just starting a career - just finished 3,4 or 8 years of study? There are not going to be too many opportunities for them opening up. Is everyone happy to see family members in this position needing to look for work in other countries as there will be a paucity of them in UK? I would rather they all had the choice of staying or going.

I learned recently that the EU budgets are calculated every 7 years . We are at the moment only 2 years from the end of the current 7 years which ends in 2020. Why do we have to pay any more money than the obligations we have up to 2020 ( plus I appreciate a reasonable amount for the undoubted inflated pensions of our own MEP's) after 2020 the EU budget would be renegotiated again without our contribution.

For the record I voted to remain .

As there is no idea yet of how UK nationals will be treated in the EU, they will not be keen to apply or even have interviews in the EU27, and will have to go further abroad.

gilly on going projects to which we are a signature is one.
Money towards the various agencies, which we have indicated we don’t want to leave.
These amongst other stuff is our liability.

Yes I get that whitewave but the budgets are all set in 7 year blocks ( I can't copy a link from my phone) and this 7 year block ends in 2020.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-eu-referendum-36368792

I think this might be it ?

But the budgets are huge - so presumably the payments sound huge to us mere mortals - shown as a percentage of GDP gives a better idea -anually it is about1% for all countries. I don't think we will be paying any more than our share - as whiteW said it is the ongoing projects we signed up to. The EU is still contributing to UK for agreed projects etc until the end of the budget period.

So our liability to the end of the budget has been recognised by May in Florence. That is the 20bn etc we’ve agreed.

The rest is still under discussion and why there has been so much silly speculation as to the amount.

Is that what you mean? Sorry to be dim if I’m wrong

That’s to gill btw

Yes whitewave it is exactly what I mean.

Thank you

And the end of the budget period is 2020 welshwife which is the point I am trying to make .