Corbyns Momentum

YOU say I am insulting them, across the country. I don't think I am.
You are going to have to point out where I am. Otherwise it's just childish insults, as usual.

Jen, I do not have to do anything , I am bored with this rubbish, have more important things to think about.

Childish again. Never mind.

Nobody forces 16 and 17 year olds to join the services.
If they do join up, they will be looked after, well paid and trained to do a number of jobs, all this talk of killing and trained killers is OTT unless they join the SAS.
Of course they need to be able to use weapons, as it may be needed, ususally for defensive purposes.They will not be allowed to use weapons in combat situations until they are 18.This is an adult btw at age 18,not a ‘child’.
The Army, Navy and Air Force have supported and trained many young men and women in all sorts of jobs.
For those who choose to join from what is called disadvantaged backgrounds, it has often saved them from humdrum low paid jobs or from hanging about and joining gangs or getting into crime.
There are thousands of others who choose to join from middle and upper class families btw
All this UK bashing, and Services bashing, is what I have come to expect from a few posters.

Kids train in the Cadets from 12 years old.

How can saying that it is wrong to train for the army, with arms, from such a young age- can be seen as UK bashing? In any way, shape or form - or insulting to anyone.

And a reason for giving up British nationality of over 40 years.

England was my home for 40 years- I loved it always will do. My family is still there- my adored grandchildren - and this gives me the right to criticise some aspects I believe to be detrimental and a danger to them.

Nobody forces kids to join - at 12, or at 16 - but they are enticed, with excitement, trips, activities and even money. And when and if the time comes- the exciting trips become - war and death. For many, the death of others, friends, or even the enemy- becomes the stuff of nightmares forever. Like for my ex neighbour in the UK who was a Lancaster bomber over Dresden- and had nightmares and dark dark moods- although (or perhaps because) he was such a lovely man and father.

And some come back crippled, mentally and physically- and see how they are well cared for - sleeping on the streets due to mental health issues caused by what they have seen and done.

Hope you'll be out there to care for them in the freezing cold over Christmas.

More melodrama.
They were army conscripts ( Dresden bombing) so let us not hark back to the war.
The 12 year olds ( it will be 13 at expensive Public Schools) that join the services cadet force, either like it or they don’t,
It won’t affect them otherwise.It is usually only for an hour or so once a week.
You are making mountains out of molehills jura
Back to Corbyn?

Was the bombing of Dresden not in WW2, thousands enlisted , should all have become conscientious objectors ?

I thought you had better things to think about, Annie.

Corbyn claimed troops fighting in the .Falklands were unemployed

I would really appreciate a link annie as I can’t discuss this until I can see where you are coming from.

You will of course Lemongrove, choose to misread what I write- my point was about the lasting damage war has on soldiers on all sides- physically, but also emotionally and mentally. And this even when they were on the 'right side'.

Denying this is incredibly uncaring and sorry but, stupid
Have you never met people, read books or seen films- about the lasting mental and emotional damage- to all soldiers who have been to war? How on earth can you say that acknowledging this is 'melodramatic' is beyond me.

Kids should not be trained or encouraged to serve. Very few countries in the world see that as 'normal'- was my other point.

But keep attacking - keep distorting, keep being nasty and unpleasant- it sadly says an awful lot about you.

Joyeux Noël.

I posted a link whitewave

Oh thanks where?

On this thread

Right will have a look

Kids should not be trained or encouraged to serve
Interesting jura. On those grounds are you campaigning for National Service to be done away with in Switzerland and for reducing the numbers of guns held by civilians in that country?

telling someone to give up their nationality because they do not always agree with you - is .... well, truly offensive.
I don't think I told you do do anything jura - I would not be so presumptuous. I was merely asking (if that is OK) why you wish to retain citizenship of a country you appear to despise.
Now I know that you have British family I understand why you may not wish to do so.

Asking why and Telling have very different meanings.

Of course, there is the other viewpoint - that young people from deprived backgrounds and with no hope may enlist in the forces (not necessarily the Army but that is the one always quoted on here) and receive training, learn discipline, enjoy comradeship, get well fed (perhaps for the first time in their young lives) and learn to love outdoor pursuits.

All of these things will stand them in good stead for their future whether or not they stay in the forces as a career.

Right

During the Thatcher period there was 3 million people unemployed.

Many of these unemployed young men joined up in order to gain some sort of employment. I remember hearing that argument being made.

Thatcher went to war with Argentina which was not supported by a large percentage in the UK. Including Corbyn. I didn’t support it for reasons that are not necessary to go into.

So ergo many of the young men exposed to injury and death were unemployed who had joined up.

I am thankful that they are there for our defence and that of our overseas families.
I did not want them to go into an illegal war without adequate equipment and for that I will never forgive Blair. They did not join up for that; they are not aggressors but defenders and liberators - politicians can be the aggressors.

What a weak defence whitewave, in fact no defence at all, he said unemployed men . Sad, so sad

That wasn’t a defence annie that was my explanation!

Hard to find a year since the 2nd world war when British troops were not involved in a war somewhere in the world.
Never in the UK, though, so how is that defence of the country?
Switzerland are not allowed by law to fight anywhere outside their own country.
However, they are part of the UN peace keeping force.
I can appreciate that.

I now understand what he meant that is all. Simples and for me entirely understandable.

I can so remember the argument about the young unemployed.

I think you will find that British troops are mainly peacekeepers too - and there to aid in places that have been hit by natural catastrophes:

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4868230/Hundreds-troops-arrive-Britain-s-Caribbean-islands.htmlhttp://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4868230/Hundreds-troops-arrive-Britain-s-Caribbean-islands.html

Ooh, I'm sorry, it's the Daily Mail!

However, I did see people being interviewed on tv who were so very thankful at the expertise and wonderful help given to them by British troops.