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Let's not Forget Brexit(2)

(474 Posts)
Cindersdad Thu 02-Nov-17 09:04:57

It seems that 1000 posts is the limit for a thread, so carrying on I have to commend Day6 for persistence though really cannot understand any of the reasons LEAVER have given.

Let's we get the full disclosure of the Brexit impact statements. I want to try to avoid repitition but we have probably said at one time or other everything to say about Brexit.

The bottom line is that we will be worse off outside the EU. Yes there fault with the EU but outside we can do nothing inside we have a say.

The referendum result was based on lies. The LEAVE campaign finances are not above suspicion.

whitewave Mon 13-Nov-17 17:01:53

Twitter is luke warm about the concession. I think that Davis hasn’t gone far enough by the sound of it.

Back to the drawing board.

whitewave Mon 13-Nov-17 17:10:03

The trouble is that Davis is known for lying so how can we take anything he says seriously?

For instance on 25th June he told Marr that there were between 50 and 60 impact assessments completed in detail.
On the 7th November he said that it is not the case that 58 impact assessments exist.
@grovewhite

mostlyharmless Mon 13-Nov-17 17:19:16

This doesn't sound like a meaningful vote on offer to Parliament. The Commons could amend the Withdrawal Bill, but then there is no obligation for the EU to accept the amendments.
David Davis says this vote can't reverse the Brexit decision!
Deal or no deal.

whitewave Mon 13-Nov-17 17:20:46

harmless that’s what twitter is saying. Slippery eel is Davis. Untrustworthy.

mostlyharmless Mon 13-Nov-17 17:29:44

And Davis says there would be a three line whip on the vote for Conservatives.
So not a free vote. Meaningless vote really.

mostlyharmless Mon 13-Nov-17 17:38:21

"But it swiftly became clear that the concession is less significant than it appears. To gasps from MPs, Davis confirmed that the UK would still leave the EU without a deal if the Commons voted against the government's agreement. With this declaration, the Brexit Secretary is holding a gun to MPs' heads. Were Britain to leave with no deal, the UK would face punitive tariffs, chaos at ports and even grounded air flights. But to avoid this outcome, MPs would be forced to accept the Conservatives' "hard Brexit", including withdrawal from the single market and the customs union."
from The New Statesman just now.

MaizieD Mon 13-Nov-17 17:48:25

But, Davis says we leave with no deal if MPs vote down the final agreement.

Surely no responsible MP would let that happen hmm

MaizieD Mon 13-Nov-17 17:49:06

OOPs, sorry, you've moved on and noted that already...

Welshwife Mon 13-Nov-17 17:52:03

No choice at all really.

durhamjen Mon 13-Nov-17 18:06:26

Allowed to go through it line by line, though.
That must be his favourite line.

whitewave Mon 13-Nov-17 18:11:16

??there may be trouble ahead ?

whitewave Mon 13-Nov-17 18:17:08

Looks to me that we are going over the cliff regardless. Just as well get it over and done with now.

whitewave Mon 13-Nov-17 18:22:48

Why are they so intent on wrecking the U.K.?

I so hoe that the Brexiters are deluded in thinking they can get away with it

whitewave Mon 13-Nov-17 18:26:28

Starmer is tweeting that the court of appeal ruled that only parliament can take us out of the EU.

Welshwife Mon 13-Nov-17 18:28:05

In theory they will do if they pass the deal!

whitewave Mon 13-Nov-17 18:36:12

Kuenssberg tweeted that the Tory rebels are meeting now.

varian Mon 13-Nov-17 18:50:37

I saw a TV interview with Chuka Omunna, a Labour mainer, and Peter Bone, a Tory Brexiteer. Bone came across as a swivel-eyed fanatic, but I am sorry to say Chuka did not counter his rubbish as strongly as he should have done. He still bowed to this mythical "will of the people" rubbish.

Surely the time has come for the parliamentary majority who believed in 2016 that we should remain in the EU to stand up for their beliefs and start to say enough is enough.

We should EXIT BREXIT. If it is not possible to negotiate a reasonable deal, which leaves the UK in a better position than we are now , we should REMAIN in the EU.

mostlyharmless Mon 13-Nov-17 18:54:44

Orwell again.
Davis's speech is a prime example of "doublespeak". Sounds like a concession to Parliamentary process, but in reality will force Parliament to accept whatever deal the Government has managed to scrape together.

varian Mon 13-Nov-17 19:04:16

Chuka is of course, a Remainer.

There are many Tory Remainers who have been bullied into accepting something they do not believe will be in the interests of their constituents or the country. It is time for them to speak up and say "enough is enough". Brexit should not happen. We still believe it is wrong. EXIT BREXIT.

mostlyharmless Mon 13-Nov-17 19:14:02

Unfortunately, Labour's position on Brexit is still not clear cut. They are offering a cautious welcome to Davis's "concession". Will of the People mantra still?

mostlyharmless Mon 13-Nov-17 19:18:44

Any ideas varian ? How can we Exit Brexit? MPs seem to be in awe of the referendum result.
The country seems to be trapped in a Brexit vortex with no way out.

varian Mon 13-Nov-17 19:38:43

This is a start

www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-date-time-theresa-may-eu-withdrawal-bill-law-dominic-grieve-tory-rebel-minister-henry-viii-a8052076.html

Welshwife Mon 13-Nov-17 19:40:01

Maybe they will nit pick enough clauses in the bill going along that the Govt gets its sanity back and withdraws article 50!

mostlyharmless Mon 13-Nov-17 19:49:47

Well let's hope so. It won't be easy though.

varian Mon 13-Nov-17 20:00:59

The main obstacle is the power of the rightwing tabloids. No democracy should allow foreign billionaires and tax exiles to control 80%+ of the national newspapers.