Regret it Brexit?

Very interesting varian. How can the country have such an important ongoing debate about immigration without knowing the figures?
The number of highly qualified immigrants- doctors and academics - rather than the public perception as being mainly unskilled, is very important to the debate.

I agree Joelsnan the Irish border issue is as much the EU's responsibility as it ours. It's as if they don't know what to do so are making it 'our problem' so they can absolve themselves of any responsibility.

I’m a Geordie Allygran1 Hence my worry about how Brexit will effect NE manufacturing.

From the postings I thought you probably were from the North East gillybob. I am from the other side the North West. Your concerns are understandable. From what I gather you are also in business so you would be remiss not to keep an eye on external factors. I was in business myself and it's always tough.

Mostlyharmless it might be that we don't have the figures on highly qualified immigrants maybe partly because they come under free movement from EU Countries. Within that group many may also be immigrants from Countries outside the EU who have become citizens of the EU Countries.
There will of course be other immigrants from outside the EU the figures on those people we should have.
But I don't sense that immigration is a main concern within the leave voters at all.It certainly isn't for me.

Smilesless2012 it would be interesting if the UK choose to do nothing to change the border in Ireland. That would force the EU to either accept what we have proposed; a high tech border with trusted trader status to allow free movement with controls, or would they install a hard border on their side.

Article written by a one man band really.

Ireland has been a British problem for hundreds of years not an EU one. The manner in which the people were treated by the British Govt was disgraceful.

So allygran you didn’t actually read Varian’s post and link that I was referring to. Or if you did you didn’t understand it.

Quote Allygran1[ Smilesless2012 it would be interesting if the UK choose to do nothing to change the border in Ireland. That would force the EU to either accept what we have proposed; a high tech border with trusted trader status to allow free movement with controls, or would they install a hard border on their side.] End Quote

The EU would undoubtedly set up a hard border on the Irish Republic side of the border to solve "their problem"

The above would in my opinion undoubtedly restart the troubles/war which would be "our problem"

The number of highly qualified immigrants- doctors and academics - rather than the public perception as being mainly unskilled, is very important to the debate

I agree, and those living here will remain. Once we are out of the EU those people who bring skills and qualifications needed in the UK won't be turned away, will they?

We won't be closing doors on people who want to work in the UK where there are skills vacancies, but merely regulating who comes here. An open door immigration policy isn't in the interests of any country. Many countries have entry requirements which are much stricter than ours. Elsewhere most immigrants have to be self-supporting. We are a welfare state and unrestricted numbers entail a drain on all already struggling services, transport systems, health systems, schools and would create greater housing needs than we have already.

A sensible and compassionate immigration policy isn't racist, it's practical and necessary, especially given European countries have been terrorist targets. We allow open door immigration at our peril unfortunately.

In a Utopian environment we'd all travel freely and without restriction. UK citizens cannot do that. Is that liberty granted to anyone?

I agree grandad
We can’t risk the Good Friday Agreement.
Refusing to negotiate with the EU would also result in No Deal and a hard “cliff edge” Brexit which would be disastrous for our economy.

You have NO idea how the economy will be in 2019, 2020, 2021.

You have NO idea of the trade deals we may do elsewhere and the knock-on effect for our economy.

You have NO idea of the investment there will be in the UK after Brexit. Right now, it's very healthy, even with Brexit looming and not finalised yet.

Most people have more faith in the UK than Project Fear doom-mongers.

You are making predictions and they are all catastrophic, because you are a Remainer.

You like to think life is static and that what we have now is set in stone. In terms of the economy nothing is guaranteed and experienced forecasters appreciate that. The governor of the Bank of England got it wrong. His gloomy predictions didn't come to pass and he had to admit his misjudgement.

Yes, it's wise to try and anticipate the future, and it is wise to plan for the future. Just as the future isn't guaranteed, neither is the economy. We may find ourselves in new markets with a booming economy. That prediction is just as likely as yours, but sour grapes keep the doom-mongering Project Fear Remainers chuntering away about how awful everything is and will be, forever more.

mostlyharmless and grandad. Is Northern Ireland still the tinder box it was in the 60s? With the decline of heavy industry and shipbuilding in the province the sectarian religion based workplace divide is not as pronounced as it was.
Free movement did not increase the violence which one may have expected.
Isn't it a bit like saying German must rebuild the Berlin Wall in case trouble starts again. UK wants a soft border, if the EU chose to impose a hard border wouldn't the fall out be of their making?
BTW immigration was not my reason for voting out, it was a case of research and realise it's best to get out mow before we are dragged into the implosion, at least we can be forging trade ties without being in the scramble which will ensue when the dream becomes the nightmare. Scrape beneath the surface and the problems are glaring.

Does a "soft border" mean that any goods or people arriving in the Irish Republic from the EU can just cross into NI without any checks then proceed to the rest of the UK?

If so, how is that us "controlling our borders"?

Day6 in response to your posting today (10/05/18 @ 18:15) Undoubtedly immigration was a major factor in the leave decision as a result of the referendum. That decision is very understandable as rapid change has taken place in many areas of Britain in which many felt that they had not been consulted adequately in regard to that change.

However, it has since been recognised that there is as much diversity of occupation within that immigration as there are ethnic cultures coming to Britain. Many think on immigration as unskilled labour taking or undercutting employment pay rates from those already in low skill employment. The foregoing, can undoubtedly be true, but as stated there are other levels of immigration that are heavily required in the UK and that situation is already creating huge problems within many industries and professions.

As has been widely reported in the media the NHS is having severe problems recruiting nurses, doctors and midwives etc. In the engineering and science again severe problems are being encountered recruiting high qualification and skills personnel, and in the professions similar severe problems continue to grow.

All the above is occurring even before Britain actually takes leave of the European Union. In that the problem would seem to be that many who would have sought residency and employment in the UK prior to the referendum no longer see Britain as a welcoming place to live and therefore no longer come, hence the growing skills and qualifications shortage.

It has been stated that Britain could and should train far more people in those skills and professions and therefore close those deficiencies. However, many it would seem in education do not wish to learn the above skills and instead take humanity and arts studies for their degree and other advanced studies.

It can be argued that the above is a failing in the UK education system, and that in my opinion is the case but not for debate I believe in this thread. That stated, it would seem that we are all learning that at many levels, immigration is a factor that Britain is finding difficult to thrive into the future without.

Mostlyharmless I am not engaging so safe your breath. If you want a fight go somewhere else.

Grandad you have a point.

Grandad
I gave a few theories on education and how it meets the needs of the changing employment requirement, but am not sure how to start it off as a new thread.

Can you give us any companies who have said they are intending to invest in U.K. big time when we have left the EU Day6 - so far I have only seen companies saying how they are leaving and moving to mainland Europe or that existing contracts will be fulfilled but not renewed.

Mark Carney got it wrong in that the economy only grew at half the expected amount so they did not raise interest rates. The rise was so small it will hardly be noticed.

Many skilled people are leaving the U.K. and taking jobs elsewhere - the number of nurses from foreign countries has greatly declined and in their wisdom the HO refused visas to Indian doctors who had jobs to go to. Many skilled EU people are being refused the right to remain even though they have lived in Britain for many years - many having married British people and have a family and have worked and paid into the system. For some strange reason the HO are unable to have access to the NI and tax records which would easily prove these facts and ask the people for documentation which is difficult to show. Many people are put off coming to U.K. as they hear all about the hostile environment. There is no guarantee for them.

Allygran1,

please don’t dictate or indicate that another poster should go somewhere else this is a forum for everyone & everyone doesn’t need to be policed by you.

BTW immigration was not my reason for voting out, it was a case of research and realise it's best to get out mow before we are dragged into the implosion, at least we can be forging trade ties without being in the scramble which will ensue when the dream becomes the nightmare. Scrape beneath the surface and the problems are glaring.

Absolutely Joelsnan. Well said. My fears too. It's a ship sinking slowly.

I think people must be looking at the EU through rose tinted specs. The political upheaval and anti EU sentiment in many member countries is rife. Unemployment figures are staggering and the economies of many member states is dire. The recipients of the largest grants are the ones protesting least.

It's costing the UK billions every year to tie itself to that.

There will be a guarantee for them if we can choose who we want here and their skills, that’s one of the joys of being able to please ourselves as a nation once out of the EU.

Bridget it wasn't meant that way. But I take your point I should have said pick on someone's maybe.
Apology. But I am not having all that again.

Bridgiet
It should read pick on someone else. The else was missed off.

Bridgiet

I should point out that I was not policing anyone and certainly not everyone. I responded to a not very nice posting from one individual.