so, when will you be starting stockpiling I wonder?

I shall start with toilet rolls, remembering last time (when in fact the warehouses were stocked full of them).

I shall stock tea bags and trade them for loo rolls and tins of baked beans.

Grandad 1943

Social Dumping, you must have heard that expression.

I am interested in your posts re the level of trained HGV drivers and Brexit and how that sits with your obvious 'Union' connections and knowledge. The Union position not so long ago and indeed Corbyns view were anti the EU regarding the EU Workers Directive which put paid to so many of our UK workforce holding on to their jobs, including HGV drivers.

I know for a fact that in my area alone UK drivers were laid off in favour of cheaper EU drivers, it happened to friends and family at major supermarket chains distribution centres here. Are you of the opinion that the lack of UK HGV drivers has no bearing on the EUWD??

I was reminded of a post I submitted in response to a prolific poster no longer on GN? a year ago and I make no apology to anybody for repeating either it or the length of the post but I raise it to debate the point.

Note the date!!!

POGS Mon 03-Jul-17 11:08:04

I have made mentioned 'many times' the problems for British Workers of the ' European Union Workers Directive''. It is a regulation that allowed for EU workers to work in the UK on the wages of the country they came from, UNDERCUTTING British workers wages. I believe there has recently been a vote to say the payment should be that of the country they are now working in but that comment needs checking. I believe that Corbyn and the Unions had an issue with the EU Workers Directive also, for obvious reasons.

I stand by what I say.
--

I have further looked into The European Workers Directive which I clearly stated had recently been voted on for change.

This is the new Directive which does now state the following and to which you refer and I did say I thought had been introduced:-

ec.europa.eu/social/main.jsp?catId=471

maximum work periods and minimum rest periods
minimum paid annual holidays
the minimum rates of pay (including overtime)
health and safety at work
protection for women who are pregnant or have just given birth
equal treatment for men and women and other rules to prevent discrimination
hiring out agency workers

What you did not post was another section in the Directive which states:-

Revision of the Posting of Workers Directive

' On the 8 of March 2016, the European Commission 'proposed' a revision of the rules on posting of workers within the EU to ensure they remain fit for purpose. Until Member States and the European Parliament have agreed on the revision and the new rules have entered into force, ' the current rules remain in place'.
-

The European Workers Directive is/was commonly known as 'Social Dumping' and as far as I can see it there is still controversy/problems surrounding the 'new' and yes improved workers rights on equal pay.

The 'new/improved' Directive has not been officially passed by the 28 EU Nation States thus far hence the Directive states :-

Until Member States and the European Parliament have agreed on the revision and the new rules have entered into force, ' the current rules remain in place'.

The European Workers Directive most certainly does UNDERCUT wages and if a company is self governing and applying the revised Directive well good on them but that may not be the case.

The European Workers Directive was started in 1996 and has been an issue ever since. An old example would be the 2009 mass walk out by Refinery Workers at the Lindsey Refinery , Immingham .

news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/humber/7855752.stm

'Mass walkout over foreign labour'

"Unite shop steward Garry Scales said: "We are angry that workers have been taken on from outside the UK when people here are out of work."

This article is one of many that are informative if anybody can be bothered to read it:-

www.euractiv.com/section/social-europe-jobs/news/posted-workers-revision-gets-off-to-shaky-start/

Quotes

"The new proposal intends to redress so-called ‘social dumping’, where European companies use low-cost workers to circumvent the labour laws of the host country.

The revision of the 1996 EU law has sparked controversy in the past, as the 28-country bloc struggles to reconcile the freedom to offer cross-border services, a cornerstone of the internal market, with clear differences in wages and levels of social protection.

An average hour of work costs an employer €40 in Denmark and €39 in Belgium, but only €3.80 in Bulgaria, €4.60 in Romania or €8.40 in Poland, according to Eurostat data for 2014.
---

I would have thought you being a good Union man/supporter would have been concerned over the European Union Workers Directive over the years?

tins of baked beans.
not sure about the baked beans Chewbacca, there is mention of the perils of emissions contributing to global warming.

POGS, many thanks for your comprehensive post of yesterday (30/07/18). That stated, for you to gain my views will take an equal comprehensive answer and I am in the office again today, so will try to give that answer later.

However, for a quick reference, the European workers Directive had no effect on LGV drivers as they are governed by the EU Drivers Hours Regulations. so, if anyone reads those regulations they may see what I am referring to there.

With regard to the influx of drivers from EU countries into Britain, again feel that it had little effect on LGV drivers as in the growing economy we had at that time they simply supplemented an already difficult driver recruitment situation.

In regard to Distribution Centre internal staff, the EU workers directive has had little effect as flexibility is essential in regards to hours worked and therefore all staff are asked to wave their rights to that act, which they always do in the vast majority of cases.

As stated POGS I will try to make a more comprehensive post later in regards to the above, time allowing, on what is a very complicated subject when. It comes to the transport industry.

grandad You keep referring to LVG drivers. What does the 'L' stand for please?

Jalima at the start of this long thread, I mentioned that if stock piling Nicky toilet rolls would be top of my list.
I believe they are part of the softel group which is Italian owned.
It would seem however that the paper is milled in the UK and Nicky supports UK woodland Trust.
I would therefore presume that even if the Italian company 'pulled out of the U.K. We have the mills in situ to produce our own loo rolls.
will not have resort to wiping our bums
on Sun/other newspapers

--will not have resort to wiping our bums
on Sun/other newspapers--

It's an appropriate use for them (if a bit harsh)

I thought it was LGV ( light goods vehicle ) MazieD could be wrong though

MaisieD in t'old days when the toilet was in the back yard, people often used strips of old newspaper for that very purpose.

If the choice was only between newspaper and Izal loo roll, newspaper for me

Oh Annie, Izal!

Before we married my husband had only ever experienced Izal. He said marriage had changed his life

Eglantine, if it was put in school loos now there would be charges of child cruelty

I don't know if anyone watches Inside the Factory on TV, but the last episode was about a factory in Manchester that makes loo rolls.

Ilovecheese can you remember what channel?
It might be still on catch up.

in t'old days when the toilet was in the back yard, people often used strips of old newspaper for that very purpose.

I remember it well! Many an evening was spent tearing newspaper into squares and then my dad would thread a piece of string through a hole in the corners. Even the string was recycled for the next time! Thinking back on it, there must have been thousands of people with newsprint on the bums!

The thought of having squares of The Sun hanging on a hook inside the lavatory door is making me feel quite queasy!

Izal please - or Bronco

I can't think of a better use for The Sun Jalima!

Yes, but sometimes, when they're sitting there, some people tend to read what's available!
And it would means buying it in the first place

But it would be the first time its been useful wouldn't it?

I shall stockpile prossecco, and champagne. When it runs out I shall try English sparkling wine, which I hear is very nice???

We'll be round GrannyGravy - will you barter champagne for Bronco toilet rolls?

Last night I was thinking about a post on here (it could be on another thread) about stockpiling, which disturbed me a bit. I will try to find it and respond.

Jalima1108 you are welcome, if we are going to 'hell in a handcart' as it's predicted, I am going out with good friends, good food, good fizz and merry.

Nobody has a clue what is going to happen, even those in charge, I am definitely trying to be positive, cannot deal with all the negativity that we are bombarded with from all forms of media. ??

Yes, it was on here and it was Grandads* post of yesterday, 22.09:
Well, with such reports becoming now widespread, Carol my wife and me have genuinely decided to begin stocking up. Tinned vegetables and meats will be the main commodity drawing on our experience of camping with our three young daughters many years ago.
In those days with sufficient tins of potatoes, peas, green beans accompanied by a large tin of minced beef and onion I could knock up a meal for five on the camp stove in next to no time.

The reason this disturbed me somewhat is because, if people do start panic buying all these kinds of foods and loading up their store cupboards, presumably these are the kinds of people who can well afford to do so. If they can afford to stockpile tins and packets of food then they could presumably afford to shop locally from farm shops etc, ie locally grown unprocessed food, if a problem with the supply chain arises.

If tinned, packeted, dried foods disappear rapidly from the shelves then could this cause problems for people who rely on food banks to help to feed their families? These are the types of food that many people buy regularly to donate to food banks (not an ideal diet, but better than families going hungry).

And if, as has been said, these processed foods are made here from imported food, then would that mean a halt in the production and the supply of these processed foods?

Does it seem to be a selfish move for the better-off to empty the shelves of long-life foodstuffs by panic buying, spreading the word on the internet and causing shortages for those relying on food banks?

Just a thought and I hope you can follow what I am trying to say and that this is not tltr.