Labour Party and anti semitism

Perhaps we should just leave these two to carry on their back and forth, repetetive discussion?

Attempts to move the debate on is pointless.

Exactly Annie he is a rabble rouser par excellence, but very little else.

Seems his past must be ignored lemon, but I cannot ignore it, he is an activist not a leader

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There is plenty in Corbyn’s past to take issue with!

PECS if they are to be believed then there are people inside the LP colluding in this too.

As the discussion is moving on to the cause and effect behind the currents so-called ‘anti-semitism’ debate this is and interesting and very recent opinion from Gershom Gorenberg July 31 at 4:41 PM

Gershom Gorenberg is an Israeli historian and journalist.

“Here’s a story that didn’t make it into the Israeli news media, but should have: The day that the Knesset passed the controversial “nation-state law,” the president of the American Federation of Teachers, Randi Weingarten, issued a statement saying that the law “repudiates the democratic, egalitarian and pluralist values on which the state of Israel was founded.”

Weingarten added that it “embodies a bigotry and authoritarianism that I fear was energized and emboldened by the current U.S. president.”

My angle on this whole debacle is that there are people who, external to LP, want to stem growth of the political left. How do you do that? You undermine the new leader who has attracted new members. You find nothing in his personal past to discredit so you use his support for a cause and falsely equate it with hating another popular group. We have seen how easy it is to manipulate "truth" re Brexit etc. It is what spooks do all the time. So many rt wing groups happy to appear to support Jewish groups now if it supports their end goal/ bigger picture. There are racists every where, including people who are anti Semetic.. no political party can say it is not happening at all within their ranks. I have met many racist Tories and a few supporting other parties. Let's be honest.

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Just popped back into this thread to see how it was progressing, a great post Allygran and although we do have to deal with/see things in the here and now, understanding how we got to this point is key.
Corbyn needed to have spoken out ( about his old friend, the bully boy) yesterday, as soon as he possibly could.
That somebody could feel so confident about a rant like that at an important meeting just shows the direction ‘of travel’ the LP is now going in.
All Corbyn does, time after time is to say how sorry he is that people may feel offended blah blah.This is not
leadership, in fact he is not a leader in any shape or form.
Things have slid downwards under his control ( or rather lack of it) and even a strong leader would have a difficult time in halting it now.

Suppose in fairness I have to agree , not speaking of Jeremy Corbyn is in fact raising the debate

So are you pleased the Labour Party leader supports Palestine against Israeli aggression and wants Israel to fulfil the directives of the UN?
I have never compared Gaza to the death camps of WW2. Nothing is the same as that.
I do think however that there can be parallels drawn between the tactics a government uses to make its citizens view a group of people as less than human.
There is a growing resistance in Israel against Netanyahu extreme nationalism... as anyone on the political left should support.

in no way do I support what is happening in Gaza but....

I condemn what is happening in Gaza

PEC, in no way do I support what is happening in Gaza but no way do i compare it with the death camps.

I am still upset that Jews, Buddhists, Muslims and other faiths are classed incomers to the U.K.

Anniebach what is your opinion of support for Palestine by JC.

Fennel 'Tis a consummation devoutly to be wished

Thank you Allygran1 (and others) for raising the level of debate. This is indeed a serious issue and the questions raised here, and in the media, within the LP and across the political spectrum really needed airing.

There is no simple solution, no definitive definition that will satisfy all parties, but opening the subject to debate might just allow in some fresh air and fresh ideas.

They have not been answered they have been defended and not with the truth

I choose not to move on from my views of a leader who tolerates racism and terrorism , you want to Trisher

Amen to that trisher.

You have raised all those issues before Annie and they have been answered. Try moving on.

And what of Corbyn trisher? You have defended him against accusations of supporting the IRA, of supporting anti semitism, he has now apologised for holding a meeting on halocaust day where the government of Israel was compared with the Nazi.

He attended memorial services for a member of the IRA .

He shared a platform with IRA members yet denied he had ever met them, but according to Abbott he did share the platform but didn’t speak to them .

He remained silent when a momentum member abused one of his own MP’s, a Jew. He remained silent at the NEC meeting when that NEC member spouted his anti semetic rant.

He has now apologise,not for the views of those people, only for any hurt which may have been caused .

Allygran1 thank you for your link about the Jewish concept of the British attitude towards the ceation of a Jewish state. It is interesting and a real lesson in how presenting an argument by giving only selected information can acheive an aim. The position of the British in that area after the war was untenable. They were under attack by Jewish freedom fighters (who would now be referred to as terrorists) and naturally restricted interaction. But it never helps to interpret history purely from one point of view. All we can do is look at things as they are today and try to improve things for the future and there is no doubt that the policies pursued by the state of Israel are making life more difficult for Palestinians, that Israel has successively failed to implement UN resolutons and is pursuing a policy of expansion. The sad thing is that the policy is unlikely to succeed. Historically it has never been possible to completely subjugate a people and eventually they do rise again. In the meantime deaths and suffering on both sides continue. Under the IHRA rules this post would probably considered anti-semitic, it isn't. I have no prejudice against any Jews and live in an area where there is a large community of very traditional Jewish people whose lifestyle is very different, but who have a perfect right to live as they wish. Just as the other ethnic communities in the area do. I only wish the same could happen in the area where Palestinians and Israelis live.

Eloethane, every time anti semitism is brought up I can now say you have admitted your views and opinions could define you as anti semetic and omit the rest of your post.