Call off the dogs Corbyn

Anniebach

" Momentum has announced they will not discuss Brexit at the Labour Conference. "

Maybe Brexit will not be discussed in the Conference Hall but no doubt outside of the hall it will be.

Why would Brexit be an unspoken of subject again this year?

OldMeg Wed 12-Sep-18 09:25:11

" See how things get twisted and misinformation is spread?

Lemongrove no one has been asked to swear an ‘oath of allegiance to Corbyn’ what has been asked is that hopefuls (ie those who want to represent the party as MPs) must agree to “fully implement” the manifesto of Labour if the party get into government."
-
Do you mean POGS not Lemongrove?

What do you believe this part of the text that candidates are expected to endorse means :

" To revitalise the Labour Party by building on the values, energy and enthusiasm of the Jeremy for Leader campaign "

If this ' Oathe of Allegience' is still being required of individuals to get Momentum backing it is Momentum demanding the signatories loyalty to Momentum ,whatever Momentum decides is its agenda. It is the Labour Party as ordained by Momentum .

As for the Labour Manifesto section it says this :

' Work to ensure that Labour’s manifesto (subject to future policy development) ) is fully implemented once Labour are in Government;'

The words, ‘subject to future policy development ' cleverly does not commit to Labour’s manifesto or current policy programme as decided by party conference but to an unspecified version of the Manifesto in the future.. That could mean 'subject to ' policy if only developed by Momentum and / or only if Momentum agree with the Manifesto at the time .

Should potential Labour Councillors or MP's have to choose whether their loyalty is to the wider Labour Party or to Jeremy for Leader / Momentum Party?


You simply do not believe what is happening to the Labour Party since the Jeremy for Leader / Momentum Party was formed and as per thought at the time eventually became a Party within a Party with the focus on Corbyn the man not the wider Labour electorate.

This constituency is conservative Devro,

Oh, you must vote even if only to spoil it. If you have a good Labour MP I don't see the problem. Nothing in life or politics stays the same. We could be looking at a whole new scenario by the next election.

I don’t think I will bother to vote GrannyGravy, first time since I was 21. I have said before, voting now is rather a choice of do I want to be hanged or shot. Depressing isn’t it

Anniebach I have alway voted in every election. I have absolutely no idea what party to vote for in the next.

Have usually gone by local candidates, not sure anymore.

GrannyGravy, last year Momentum held their conference in the same town and the same days as the Labour conference, their main speaker was Corbyn. Momentum said then they would be involved with organising the Labour Conference this year.

Corbyn has vanished, John McDonald is doing the rounds instead. No doubt Corbyn will make an appearance at PMQ today with his questions written down , he will read from his notes then vanish again, this way means he can avoid interviews, avoid questions.

The party is more than confusing, it is in death throes

Please forgive me if I get this wrong (haven't had time to,google/research)

I heard Tom Watson being questioned about a speaker at the momentum conference (which I believe runs alongside the LP Conference) This lady has been found guilty of defacing the Jewish war remorial in Poland, yet is still being allowed to speak.

Tom Watson implied that JC had no power over who/what happens at momentum conference.

As an observer I find the LP very confusing and conflicted at the moment, I personally have not heard or seen that much of JC on media outlets, as the opposition leader surely he should be out there opposing!!

Harriet Harman has said Labour’s next leader must be a woman.

Diane Abbott ? gulp

See how things get twisted and misinformation is spread?

Lemongrove no one has been asked to swear an ‘oath of allegiance to Corbyn’ what has been asked is that hopefuls (ie those who want to represent the party as MPs) must agree to “fully implement” the manifesto of Labour if the party get into government.

Momentum has announced they will not discuss Brexit at the Labour Conference. So the conference will be even more pointless this year than last year. No free speech, four days spent worshiping the leader, the hall will be filled with Momentum members , yawn

Again this is not a new story as we have spoken about this on GN before .

Does the Jeremy for Leader / Momentum Party still ask potential candidates for Members of Parliament to sign the ' Oath of Allegiance to Corbyn'?

"Leftwing pressure group Momentum is asking Labour parliamentary contenders to sign a contract that ties them to the “political objectives” set out in the organisation’s constitution to secure its support in upcoming selection battles, the Observer has learned. "

" Included in the signed contract is the commitment to “revitalise the Labour party by building on the values, energy and enthusiasm of the Jeremy for Leader campaign”.

www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/nov/25/momentum-loyalty-test-would-be-mps-labour-corbyn

Practically from day one of the formation of Jeremy for Leader/Momentum Party the rhetoric has involved the
' deselection ' of Parliamentary Labour Party MP's who do not tow the line with the will of the Jeremy for Leader/Momentum Party within a Party .

Momentum control the Labour Party and if Labour MP's are deselected by Momentum backed activists and membership they should have the guts to stand as an Independent candidate and let the constituency voters decide who they choose to represent them.

They will have to chance the constituency voter backs the individual not the rosette on a pig of. * colour scenario but that is probably too much to ask.

What have they to loose?

this happen to Rosie Duffield because she took part in a demo against anti semitism, was it withdrawn because it would have brought more attention to anti semetism in the party

It doesn't necessarily follow that parachuting in a candidate for an election is a bad thing. The 2017 election was sprung on us and there wasn't time to go through the usual selection process. Candidates made it known they were interested in standing and indicated the constituency they favoured. They were usually the non winners. The alternative was not running Labour candidates. The powers that be then offered them a constituency which they could/could not accept. More important to me is how long they had been in the party, had they been involved and did they know their stuff. Some of the ones parachuted in did exceptionally well. We now have more time to decide who we want as a constituency and, as long as it is done democratically and fairly it should work.

bmacca, I agree with you

Anniebach, I think it can be a problem for local parties if they feel they’ve been landed with an MP that they really don’t know and feel little allegiance to. Especially when there can sometimes be a local person who never got a chance. I do think it’s their responsibility then to make an effort with their local party. I don’t know enough about Rosie Duffield to say whether she’s done this, but in my experience it does make a difference

Yes trisher, Frank Field did it recently

That’s interesting bmacca, so no say for the local,party, she was shipped in by HQ.

Just for clarification, re Rosie Duffield it was not a vote of no confidence but a motion to censure from her CLP. I don’t see anything wrong with party members letting their MP know they are unhappy with them.
Maybe she needs to work harder to get CLP support. From Michael Crick -
“Interestingly, I don’t think Lab members in Canterbury had any role at all in Rosie Duffield’s initial selection in 2017. Like Jared O’Mara, she was one of 36 cands elected MPs after being picked for target seats by an NEC panel, with no interview, speech, or say by local party”

All MPs are free to vote with their conscience and against the whip if they feel the party line conflicts with their own views which they have communicated to their constituency party. This can result in calls for them to be deselected and/or disciplined by the whip. However if they are a popular constituency MP this won't happen.
Annie have you never watched the "The Thick of it"? Closely based on the behaviour of Alistair Campbell. And he has admitted behaving badly, what do you imagine he was doing? Asking them all nicely to behave themselves?

Corbyn didn’t stand as an independent , he voted against the whip 428 times

MPs do represent their constituents. But most do so via a Party platform. Actually that might be a bit naive on my part as in the past some have just followed their own, or some other, agenda!

Day to day they deal with constituent matters but in the bigger national and international matters only a united Party with several hundred voters all agreeing which way they're going can influence the outcome. Thus the Party platforms.

Of course, sometimes there is a free vote in Parliament where the issue is a moral/religious one.

As I said, people who do not want to side with others in a Party (to all vote together to achieve a particular policy) can stand as independents.

Just show how naive I am. There was me thinking MPs were there to represent their constituents.
Instead:
When in that House M.P.'s divide,
If they’ve a brain and cerebellum, too,
They’ve got to leave that brain outside,
And vote just as their leaders tell 'em to.

So voters were stupid then trisher, didn’t know they could place a vote of no confidence ?

Is Jon Lansman elected ? He certaintly controls MP’s

Did no one speak out ?

Can’t even say ‘good try’ trisher

No one was deselected Annie because local party members simply accepted what they were landed with. In Parliament Alistair Campbell ruled MPs with a mixture of swearing, intimidation and threats. He has admitted this. So which is best a party where the ordinary members control the MP or one where an unelected official does it?