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Call off the dogs Corbyn

(570 Posts)
Anniebach Sat 08-Sep-18 08:37:42

At last a Labour MP has spoken out . Chuka Umunna

OldMeg Sat 08-Sep-18 08:45:32

Hello Annie

D’you know there’s nothing wrong with Corbyn’s old fashioned brand of socialism, unless you’re a Conservative or a Blairite, which I know you are not. I admire his genuine social conscience. But the one thing I do not like is the lack of diversity within the party which would be the result of certain policies.

Up until now a whole range of opinions and flavours, from the right wingers like Blair and the far left like Dennis Skinner, were tolerated. I do not want to see that taken away.

Devorgilla Sat 08-Sep-18 09:17:28

OldMeg, that's something that the new members don't seem to understand. You can be left wing and support the policies Corbyn puts forward without agreeing he is the man for the job. I didn't vote for him in either of the two leadership elections because I knew his record. He is surrounded by others I consider a lot less savoury. I also do not see why you have to join a private organisation to get your credentials as a Labour member verified. Perhaps, as Momentum has achieved its objective of bringing in new members it should now take a back seat leaving the leader to shape the party and policy. I agree with CU that a controlled party of 'yes' MPs is not good either for the party or the country. Time will tell what will fall out politically in all political arenas. We are living through a weird political period.

Anniebach Sat 08-Sep-18 09:23:17

Devro, the company a person keeps close tells you much about the person.

I do not believe the objective of Momentum was just to bring in new members. It now controls the party.

kittylester Sat 08-Sep-18 09:27:02

I just hope someone, somewhere, hurries up and actually forms a centre left party.

OldMeg Sat 08-Sep-18 09:54:48

I don’t care if their politics is to the left of Marks and Engels. What I was is diversity and tolerance.

OldMeg Sat 08-Sep-18 09:55:01

Want not was

Devorgilla Sat 08-Sep-18 09:57:33

I agree AB. However, it is made up of a lot of factions and factions tend to squabble. There is always a younger rat out there hungry for your job. I look forward to conference.
As Abraham Lincoln said, "You can fool all the people some of the time, and some of the people all the time, but you cannot fool all the people all of the time."

Anniebach Sat 08-Sep-18 10:01:54

What happened in 1983 still haunts MP’s kitty. The Gang of Four split and formed the SDP because of the far left, resulting in split votes and the tories in power.

The Corbyn Party is getting rid of centre left MP’s with the full approval of Corbyn.

Anniebach Sat 08-Sep-18 10:04:55

Devo, the praise for Corbyn’s principles and defending the appalling bullying that is taking place is so like saying

‘ that tree is beautiful let’s ignore the rotting roots.

Greta8 Sat 08-Sep-18 10:21:43

Corbyn always provokes very polarised views. I still think the reason for all the latest squabbles and controversy have the same roots as with the Conservatives, various people with leadership ambitions. I actually voted for Corbyn as leader, but am beginning to think that with the sustained press agenda against him, it might be better to have a more centrist leader. However with that I am fearful of going back to the Blair years - i.e. a quasi Tory government in all but name. The way things are going we will be lucky to have any decent public services left. Of course by that I mean public services in England, as we are subsidising Wales,Scotland and Northern Ireland massively. Having spent last weekend with Welsh family I was amazed at all the various subsidies they get that we don't. Also their council tax is half what ours is.
However the jury's still out on what will happen after Brexit, when the economy tanks it will be grim for everyone. Then we might be glad of a Corbyn type person who can ensure the poor are not disadvantaged even more than they are at present!!

Jalima1108 Sat 08-Sep-18 10:30:15

The Labour Party is a centre-left political party in the United Kingdom. It has been described as a broad church, bringing together an alliance of social-democratic, socialist and trade-unionist outlooks. The party's platform emphasises greater state intervention, social justice and strengthening workers' rights.

Mr Corbyn is still not understanding this concept.

OldMeg Sat 08-Sep-18 10:42:33

Please tell us who is defending bullying Annie

Anniebach Sat 08-Sep-18 10:50:33

Here we go, the English are giving money to the Welsh , Scots and Irish because only the English pay tax.

Why doesn’t Corbyn speak out against Brexit, get off the wall he is perched on.

Wonder why the far left had a hammering in the 1983 election and the centre left won three consecutive elections

OldMeg Sat 08-Sep-18 11:22:52

Please tell us who is defending bullying Annie I await your reply.

Jalima1108 Sat 08-Sep-18 11:34:03

Having spent last weekend with Welsh family I was amazed at all the various subsidies they get that we don't. Also their council tax is half what ours is.
Could you provide a link, please, Greta8 to the subsidies that Welsh families get compared to the English?
I'm not sure what your council tax is, but in some areas of Wales the council tax is very high compared to some areas of England.

A Band D average council tax in England is £1,672
In Wales it is less at £1,492

However, that is an 'average' and some areas of Wales will be paying £1,600+ for band D, as will some LA areas in England.

Jalima1108 Sat 08-Sep-18 11:34:57

sorry, I meant to say that some areas of England will be paying much less for Band D.

trisher Sat 08-Sep-18 11:54:24

It would be interesting wouldn't if a number of policies were put up for discussion and voting on by both the grassroots members and MPs. Then we would know precisely what this "centrist" group of MPs really want and what the party really supported. I suspect it would be very similar to the policies now in place. I also suspect that Chuka Umunna just wants to keep his name in the headlines. Much like Tony Blair. I do like this comment about the sort of government Blair deals with and who funds him. 9 million from Saudi???

lemongrove Sat 08-Sep-18 11:56:37

A year or so ago, some very left wing posters were up in arms at the suggestion that Momentum and like minded groups would try and oust moderate MP's by making them face deselection...….well, it has come to pass.

Anniebach Sat 08-Sep-18 12:01:30

Blair is not leader of the Labour Party. Corbyn is.

Chuka Umanna wants to keep his name in the headlines? Really ? I have heard little from him. He was on TV this morning in a discussion on ‘the people’s vote’ . He is very much a remainer as are so many centre left MP’s, Corbyn wants out.

OldMeg Sat 08-Sep-18 12:01:42

I see I’m not going to get an answer simply because there is none. Best if people don’t throw out wild accusations unless they can back them up as a general rule of thumb.

OldMeg Sat 08-Sep-18 12:05:18

I think Corbyn missed an opportunity to come out in favour of Leave. At the time he was very much a new leader, still wet behind the ears, known for his anti-EU stance.

Then he’s suddenly, as Leader, has to take into consideration the views of the Labour Party, which was somewhat Remain.

That’s a hard line to walk.

Anniebach Sat 08-Sep-18 12:15:37

It has come to pass lemon, . Blair was right when he said he doubts the party can now move back to centre left.

If only they could Labour would win the next election,

All we hear from Corbyn is the number of Labour Party members, he seems to think only party members can vote in the general election.

All these problems in the party takes away attention from Corbyn’s silence on the campaign for ‘the people’s vote’

Another cunning plan.

OldMeg Sat 08-Sep-18 12:22:06

There is already a centre of left party, it’s called the Lib Dem’s.

trisher Sat 08-Sep-18 12:25:25

Could we perhaps hear what these "centrist" ideas are? because if involves PPI contracts, privatising anything that's still publicly owned, cutting or restricting access to benefits or taking us into an illegal war That ain't "centrist" it's right wing. No comments about Mr Blair taking money from Saudi. And Mr Blair surely proves "you can fool some of the people...." We believed he was for Labour he wasn't. He was and is only for Mr Blair.