A leadership contest!

All those whingeing about the money we pay to the EU, as a member we get a lot back plus the access to all the free markets. As a contrast we pay more to Northern Ireland than the EU. It’s not about the money though is it?

My gut feeling is that she will survive this, but as I have never won the lottery my predictions are hardly reliable.
Whateverv her failings, she has been poorly served by Davies, Johnson, Raab and others, and in her kitten heels I would be so tempted to say A plague on both your houses and go home to bed.via a couple of very stiff G&T’s.

If the DUP don't support Mrs May, shouldn't they give the money back.

What a dog’s dinner this is turning out to be. The numbers are indicating Mrs. May will survive this confidence vote. We will find out by 9pm tonight.
Get the popcorn out ....

Day6
I was on a campsite a couple of weeks back with a lot of Germans. They are spitting nails at the prospect of paying another €3.8 billion into the pot.

How could the EU have made it easy for us to leave - what would an EU enabled Brexit look like? Would it be all about favourable trade deals and no divorce bill? Really? Why would they have done that?

This is what happens when the Tories chose to have a Remainer to implement the Leave vote. She has capitulated so much in the negotiations that the EU is totally in control. They should have chosen a hard line Brexiteer who was not afraid to stand up to the bullies in the EU and in Ireland. The Scots wouldn't have chosen someone to lead them who wanted to stay in the Union if they had won their Referendum vote, would they!

The Irish border is a non issue too. The EU also has an eastern border and trade flows freely there with goods checked electronically in the main. Why have we let ourselves be bullied by Ireland threatening a return to violence. That's disgraceful behaviour. The UK were the only ally is help bail them out when their financial difficulties were caused by adopting the euro. What short memories people have.

Nonnie you ask why leavers don' want second vote. I voted yo leave EU and would not want second vote as we voted to leave. If we ignore the results of that referendum then a referendum result becomes meaningless. Our government has respected the results of all other referenda. Scotland would insist on going back and re voting. It is disrespectful of democracy. If referendum rerun and result the same what then, go for third vote? If result changed then leave voters would riot. Look at France. Cameron sent out those leaflets to every house in UK set try ring out if we voted to leave we would be leaving SM and CU so leave voters voted for that to happen. This deal does not deliver that. If Conservatives called election without delivering Brexit they would be slaughtered by electorate.

This is all such terrible timing but a leadership challenge has been on the cards for a while.

I just hope that if we do have a new PM that he or she is completely committed to Brexit.

Interestingly Boris is sporting a decent haircut for once !

Yes, companies like BMW want to sell us goods. The EU would like a trade deal with us. But only on terms that protect the integrity of the EU and honour the commitment to the Good Friday deal. It’s some of the Leavers that are talking about quitting with no trade deal. And they tend to talk of zero tariffs on imports, so no problem for BMW. Just a problem for us!

Well still be buying their goods - they’ll just cost us more.

Exactly GranyGravy13, we have a trade deficit so EU will continue to want to sell us their hoods. I am fed up with project fear.

Who said “everything was marvellous now”? Far from it, but we shouldn’t blame all the ills of our country on the EU, we’ve got a creaking archaic political system with plenty of our own overpaid unelected bureaucrats and as for the House of Lords - a complete throwback. Why aren’t people protesting about that?

Even if May gets through this vote, she has still not got EU to get rid of backstop. She still won't get her crap deal through the house and has lost support of DUP so can't get anything through the house. She will be lame duck PM. She needs to go with grace and allow a Brexiteer to deal with Brecit.

As a remainer I'm getting to the point where I want us to leave with no deal. Yup that would be very interesting indeed.

I cannot get my head round the fact that people think that the likes of BMW, Mercedes, Audi, Bosch, Vineyards, Cheese producers, flower growers, pharmaceutical companies etc. etc. will not want to continue to sell their products in the UK at competitive prices, at the risk of job losses in these areas.

We are a nation of shoppers, they will want to supply!!

Eu are being awkward to make an example of the UK, but if it boils down to money as these things normally do, they want and need our millions in purchases and our millions in contributions to the EU.

Day6
How very true.

grannygravy13
SPOT ON.

Trump has done more for American economy than Obama ever did. I noticed the pound jumped on news of no confidence in May and ftse also up. The city needs certainty and May is a ditherer.

How exactly is it “project fear” to point out that if we trade with the whole of Europe (all our nearest neighbours) on worse terms, our economy will suffer? And please don’t reply that we’ll be free to do trade deals elsewhere, we already benefit from the trade deals signed by the EU covering all the major economies. And don’t keep banging on about free trade when it’s non-tariff barriers (regulations) that are the costly issue.

Crystaltipps - they know everything will be marvellous when we take back control

You sneer at Leavers who know damned well nothing is "marvellous" now. You assume so much when you sneer at Leavers.

I want the best for the UK. I happen to think, like the majority, that the EU is not the way forward, whether it collapses in the near future or not.

Friends residing in Europe tell me the real worry is who will be making up the shortfall when the UK leaves the EU. The burden of our missing 39 billion membership fee will fall to Germany, France etc. It's our billions rather than our membership/trade they want.

Day6

"I suspect many are now fully aware of just how intractable the EU is. To keep paying billions every year to an organisation that doesn't want us to leave and will not renegotiate the terms under any circumstances would be madness.

We are not the only member states who is questioning the power of the Brussels. The only countries who won't protest, are the smaller nations who receive more from EU funds than they contribute. We cannot close our eyes to the dire straits of the economies of many of our European neighbours.

We will be obliged to bail out the Euro for a number of years if we accept this deal.

Remainers are scare-mongering and trying to terrify the gullible into believing the UK cannot survive without Brussels interference and trade deals with Europe. That is patent rubbish."

So you are not 'scare-mongering'? I think so. How is the above different to what Leavers call 'project fear'?

TM is ( from what I can see) the only one with balls in the Tory Party. Hence her strength and they dump her at their peril.

I think Mrs May has had a really hard time. Why does nobody blame David Cameron for throwing his toys out of the pram? I also feel that the EU needs us more than we need them - why else would they make it so hard for us to leave?

lemon if you really believe in British democracy you should be supporting what Corbyn actually said in PMQs. That the HP had 5 days timetabled to debate the deal which was supposed to be the only deal. He asked if Mrs M had come back with any new proposals-she didn't answer. He asked if she would guarantee that there would be a debate before the HP adjourned for Christmas-she didn't answer. He spoke up for the process which for centuries has been the basis of our democracy and time after time she failed to answer.
If a government can't manage to pass a major piece of legislation through the commons it has traditionally collapsed. This government has been defeated 18 times on other matters but still the Tories cling to power