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Freemasons, police and the judiciary.

(30 Posts)
GabriellaG54 Tue 01-Jan-19 21:51:26

Any correlation? Myth or mystery? Bunkum or brotherhood?
Your thoughts.
Recent threads had me thinking that there could be or may have been some collusion especially after reading articles in The Guardian and Telegraph.
I do know two persons who've been members for 41 and 50 years, respectively. One is a decorated officer.

M0nica Tue 01-Jan-19 21:53:26

I think very true in the past, especially at provincial level.

I think much less so now.

Deedaa Tue 01-Jan-19 22:19:49

DH belonged to a little country lodge and no one seemed to gain any sort of advantage from it. We have one friend who is getting quite exalted in the masonic world, but he had reached a very good position in his career before his masonic involvement - not the other way round.

Anniebach Tue 01-Jan-19 22:34:50

Police and Masons ? Yes

Mamissimo Tue 01-Jan-19 22:41:27

Oh dear! Freemasonry only became ‘secret’ earlier this century when religious groups and ethnic groups were being hounded and harmed in Europe. Today Masonry is becoming increasingly open again and they are one of the largest providers of charity in the world. There is at least one women’s lodge. They are a benevolent organisation who enjoy fellowship together and who work hard for the well-being of others. More like Rotary Club than the Mafia!

MissAdventure Tue 01-Jan-19 22:44:05

I'm much more inclined to believe their are more benefits to being a mason than are openly known about than I ever used to be.

GabriellaG54 Tue 01-Jan-19 23:06:02

The police themselves don't agree with you Mamissimo.
Two articles in The Guardian (Dec '17 and Jan '18 declare that Freemasonry is blocking some promotions and various information.
Rank and file police have reported concerns re evidence in court and certain police officers.
Papal rules dictate that Catholics cannot take mass. They ban Freemasonry. I wonder how rigorously this is enforced.
Despite some saying that it's no more than an adult 'boys club', others have expressed disquiet at the secrecy/ privacy that is at it's heart.

MawBroon Tue 01-Jan-19 23:06:19

I also know a high ranking officer in the Met who was tipped to be the youngest Commissioner (? Right rank?) but who hit a glass ceiling when he 1) championed a woman officer who was being discriminated against and 2) openly stood up to the “closed shop” of Freemasonry which he encountered.

GabriellaG54 Tue 01-Jan-19 23:27:39

My brother, a middle ranking serving officer is a Freemason. He always liked being in with the in-crowd.

annodomini Tue 01-Jan-19 23:32:49

When I was young, in Scotland, the Freemasons were very open. They held a church service every year, and the two churches in the town held them in alternate years. The ministers officiated, wearing their masons' aprons. The son of one of these ministers, who also paraded, later became a very well known Member of Parliament. The youngest son, who was then still at school, subsequently became a police inspector, though I don't know if he followed in the family tradition. In the town of my birth, the Masonic Hall was let for all sorts of activities. It had a good dance floor and I went there for country dance lessons.

Mamissimo Tue 01-Jan-19 23:48:06

I think in every organisation you get a few bad apples - it’s not Freemasonry doing the’s rogue individuals who happen to be masons. If you are really interested in the facts behind the issues in the Police Federation and it’s reluctance to reform go google - there’s plenty of non sensationalised information available. Freemasons values are something that most of us aspire to:
Ethics. Our lives are based on honor and integrity, and we believe that honesty, compassion, trust, and knowledge are important.
Tolerance. The fraternity values religious, ethnic, cultural, social, and educational differences. ...
Personal Growth. ...
Philanthropy. ...
Family. ...
Go to a Freemasons open day and make your own mind up.

GabriellaG54 Wed 02-Jan-19 00:09:59

How open is open?

Florabunda60 Wed 02-Jan-19 04:13:15

Then why the secrecy?
Something they want hidden?

Teetime Wed 02-Jan-19 10:02:49

DH was asked many times during his career to join the Freemasons and he always refused on the grounds of not wanting to be in a 'secret' organisation and have secrets from me. He did however think he would have risen higher if he had said yes.

Anniebach Wed 02-Jan-19 10:05:49

It was some years ago, my husband was advised by a senior officer in the force to join, promotion would come faster. He refused.

holdingontometeeth Wed 02-Jan-19 15:19:20

Mamissimo If they are so open then why are their Almanacs not on open sale?
I tried to buy one at Waterstones and the assistant fell over laughing.
Waterstones couldn't get hold of any. They are only available to Freemasons and are supplied direct to them by whatever printing company that is run by them.
I will agree with you on one point though, Personal Advancement. That perk is available in bucket loads.
If they do so much good why aren't they identifiable?
I personally would like to thank them very much for their multitude of selfless good deeds.
For those that believe that Freemasonry is on the wane then I can only say that you are being very naïve.

holdingontometeeth Wed 02-Jan-19 15:24:17

Inside the Brotherhood: Explosive Secrets of the Freemasons.
The book by Martin Short is quiet old by now but it will give you a flavour.
If anyone can recommend more recent reading material I will be grateful.

holdingontometeeth Wed 02-Jan-19 15:27:27

Another book, Stalker, by John Stalker, will show you the corruption and power of the Freemasons, all the way up to decisions taken by top politicians top Politicians

GrannyGravy13 Wed 02-Jan-19 15:31:12

Putting my head above the parapet here - my Father was a Freemason as is my husband.

Whilst it does not call itself a secret society, it is a society with some secrets.

The books are readily available on the internet.

I can only speak of what I know of Mr.GG's lodge and that the average age must be 70+, they are generous to a fault to outside charities as well as their own.

Having been in Round Table in his younger days, Freemasonry was just a natural progression for someone who is charity minded and likes the comeradry of a mans club.

It was always a great disappointment to my Father that I did not go on to be a Lady Mason, but unfortunately I did not have the time.

holdingontometeeth Wed 02-Jan-19 15:35:30

You've got me going now.
The Poison Tree by Kevin Taylor.
One of the officers castigated by the judge according to the book later, was named in the Shipman inquiry, which followed on from when the Police found nothing suspicious.
That same officer later resigned and he was given a highly paid civilian job in the Police.
The Manchester Evening News got hold of the story and suddenly the job offer was rescinded.
They never did say why.

eazybee Wed 02-Jan-19 16:10:39

The only Freemasonry I encountered was in Education, when the fairly forceful new Head of a primary school had a disagreement with two members of staff, whose husbands were Masons, as was the Chairman of the Governors. They threatened to have her suspended, and surprise, surprise she was, but at the subsequent hearing she was completely vindicated, and as was her right, chose to have the entire governing body removed and replaced. This caused some problems with the chairman, as he was also the vicar of the local church, and it was a Church school.
I moved on before the matter was fully resolved, but they were terrified it would get into the papers, and a lot of pressure was put on the vicar to step down.

EllanVannin Wed 02-Jan-19 17:13:42

My D's late ma-in-law was in the Masons in Oz---the OES ( Order of the Eastern Star ) as I remember going to the " do " in Sydney when she took the chair. I also had a look around the temple area. Her husband was also a Mason and both had served in the military police which was where they first met. Son-in-law joined when in the UK but not in their now " home " country of Oz.

My late husband's family were and still are in the Masons and my father was. Late husband hated the Masons which is why he didn't follow suit, his father the same, no time for them.

Quite a few police officers are Masons and I believe that they also " look after their own !"

holdingontometeeth Wed 02-Jan-19 17:38:44

Nelliemoser Wed 02-Jan-19 17:57:24

My dad was very anti Masons. probably down to his socialism. He was very anti unfair privelege.

He used to rant about that a lot along with having to pay the land rent until he was able to buy it out.

(He was prone to long and quite funny rants)

holdingontometeeth Wed 02-Jan-19 18:25:47

Another link between high profile criminals and convicted Police Officers, plus a mention of Freemasonry.