Transactional politics?

I did say that perhaps it was time for a new Reform Bill MaizieD

I don't condone the offer - what I was trying to say, perhaps clumsily, should he have refused money for his constituency if he was going to vote that way anyway?
Is it pragmatism? Expediency?

If we're looking at bribery in politics and public life where to begin and where would it end?

123coco
Not much point in reading your views on the eu as it's obvious that your thinking is muddled.
Stating that Jalima voted to Leave proves this.

Please don't keep on repeating that, Jalima. I've always respected your contributions but your condoning of votes for bribes is making me feel very queasy.

he was going to vote that way anyway, wasn't he?

I doubt that anyone could manipulate Mr Mann.
He obviously wants the best for his constituents.
Would they all felt the same.

From today's Guardian:

In an article on Saturday in the Daily Mail, the Labour MP John Mann said he would not apologise for trying to get a better deal for his constituency, admitting that some MPs were seeking to leverage the government’s need for support on Brexit to their advantage.

“If [Theresa May] gives a cast-iron commitment to a national rebuilding programme that’s truly transformative in scale, and will help communities woefully neglected for decades, I will be delighted,” he wrote.

Will that make it easier for more Labour MPs to vote for her Brexit deal? Yes. But that is not bribery, it’s politics.

Someone who has lost their moral compass (if he ever had one)

It is bribery, Mr Mann.

What is more, you're being manipulated and you don't seem able to realise it.

Ah, OK.

I was rather upset.

I realise that's what she said, Jalima. I'm just saying that I think she's 'misread' whatever you've been saying on this thread and thinks that you're a Leaver. I agree it was a weird post but that is the bit that struck me the most..

Jalima ….. You seem to be part of the group who want Brexit at any cost just like the stupid people who say ‘ my business comes from the eu but I still want to leave”.
That is what she said to me MaizieD

I admit I am probably in the group now which thinks, oh, just get on with it with the best deal possible.
So perhaps I do have my head in the sand.

But crashing out with no deal at all would be a disaster.

How strange that this illiterate post is supposedly by a Remainer who thinks that anyone who voted Leave is stupid.

I think that she has misread you Jalima; clearly thinks you're a Leaver.

I have never spoken to a remainer who thinks that all leave voters are stupid. I know some who are not.

It is still true, however that, the stupider you are, the more likely it was that you voted leave.

For instance, there were some stupid people who thought that when they voted "leave" it meant that all the foreigners would be sent home and so when, on the day after the referendum, they spotted their local Polish plumber or the owner of their local Indian takeaway in the street they shouted "why are you still here? we voted leave"

There were other stupid people who voted leave because these foreigners didn't vote for us in the Eurovision Song Contest.

There were others who voted leave, like my neighbour who told me that her sister said there were too many Somalis in Bristol .

There were others who believed the Lie on the Bus.

Some actually believed we could be just like Switzerland (a rich country)

Some thought Nigel Farage, holding his pint, was just like a friend you might meet in the pub - a man of the people

There were some who had not got the first clue, but were told by their tabloid paper to vote leave and then the next day, googled "what is the EU?""

Can we not just agree that these folk were probably pretty stupid?

It may not be ethical and it is indeed a 'bribe' - but would crashing out with a deal be a better option?

123coco Fri 01-Feb-19 14:27:29

How strange that this illiterate post is supposedly by a Remainer who thinks that anyone who voted Leave is stupid.
as a Theology graduate I can tell you she does not live the teaching of Jesus!
A Theology graduate? Really?

I know many who voted Brexit who put together more reasoned arguments - however, I did not agree with them.

I think it makes it clear that the problem is a 'political' one . The longer piece possibly makes it clearer Maizie

I do.

May’s proposals,(i.e. to offer chunks of money to areas to win votes from MP) then, are perfectly justifiable in Keynesian economic terms.

I think that the New Statesman seems to have lost its moral compass somewhere...

Investing in deprived areas is indeed good Keynesian economics but using it to bribe Opposition MPs to vote for the government is reprehensible.

"May’s proposals,(i.e. to offer chunks of money to areas to win votes from MP) then, are perfectly justifiable in Keynesian economic terms. The problem she faces is a political one. The Conservatives have used the financial crisis as an excuse to drive down the living standards of workers, whilst driving up asset prices for the wealthy. The austerity agenda remains a central component of this political economic project – and a bridge here and a road there might just critically undermine it. " New Statesman

onneker I live in a Remain area too - with a fervent Brexiteer as MP.

There is, however, a difference between how the votes for the referendum were announced and how a parliamentary election is announced.
The referendum was announced by LA area not constituency area.

we don’t actually know how the national vote to Leave the EU broke down at constituency level – and so we don’t know where there might be mismatches between a Leave-voting constituency and a Remain-voting MP (or vice versa).
The above was taken from:
ukandeu.ac.uk/the-eu-referendum-how-did-westminster-constituencies-vote/

the stupid people
tweets made by the idiots

Wish I knew how to send a link

You seem to be part of the group who want Brexit at any cost just like the stupid people who say ‘ my business comes from the eu but I still want to leave”.

Unless you retract that statement I will report it - if you read any of my posts you would know that I voted Remain after a great deal of researching, thinking and against the thoughts of some of my friends who are extremely well-educated and worked at the top of some of Britain's best known industries.

Can anybody supply ' Factual Evidence ' Theresa May has offered a bribe?

Teresa May keeps finding money for her Brexit deal which, if the Conservatives had found before the referendum, might have avoided the whole sorry business. It is also intrinsically unfair. I live in a Remain area which has plenty of deprivation but we won't be offered any money because, sadly, our MP is a fervent Brexiteer so will vote for Teresa May anyway!

Please support LED by Donkeys campaign on crowdfunder. The billboards are popping up around the country reminding people of the “quotes “ and tweets made by the idiots over the last couple of yrs. yes the truth is now out there for what was promised by the likes of the snakes like Boris. Farage and Rees-Mogg Wish I knew how to send a link,

Jalimall1108 Democracy is the right to change your mind as opposed to dictatorship! You seem to be part of the group who want Brexit at any cost just like the stupid people who say ‘ my business comes from the eu but I still want to leave”. We don’t expect troops on the street because of this unconsciable behaviour of this truly hapless giver. Did you know all about the customs union or the Irishe border problems. Head in sand. Businesses leaving in droves. Where was the money for the North East from any other Tory Govt. T May May go to church but as a Theology graduate I can tell you she does not live the teaching of Jesus! I’m not religious, spiritual yes but at 16 studying 0 level RE I could see a Jesus was a socialist , in: looking out for each other, the big society etc looking out for the most vulnerable. We have become a hate filled even more racist little, inward looking country but If any leavers want to come to Lincolnshire to pick your veg feel free because British people don’t!

Actually, I would call it bribery and corruption!
It goes on all the time unfortunately.