David Lammy/Stacey Dooley

I have always wondered why it is necessary to jet celebrities out to these countries to make a film about how the money is spent. I would prefer the film to feature the workers who are there 365 days a year and the money spent on air fares and hotel rooms kept for those who need it. Celebrities could still support the charity, just do so from UK

Thank you Lily ....I thought I was the only one who physically cringed at thes first world shows of ‘we care’ rubbish. Luckily I don’t watch tv anymore ( Netflix so much better) and I don’t have to witness these self-seekers patronising all in their sight.

BUT this is a ‘show’ put on by the media to raise money. That’s the whole point.

There is a long tradition of people in the public eye using their celebrity status to do good. Bob Geldorf is just one example. So to label them ‘self-seeking’ or ‘patronising’ is unkind. What have you done Saggi and others that has raised money on this scale?

Nothing! Because you haven’t the clout or the publicity machine.

Lots of people, including children, get behind these efforts and raise funds for people less well off. The money goes to causes in the UK too.

So if you’ve nothing good to say why cock it up for those who are only doing their bit. I’d say to DL ‘if you ain’t part of the solution then you’re part of the problem’.

Anja surely it is possible for them to use their celebrity status to support the charity without travelling out of the country?

What? I think you’ve missed the point. That’s like saying David Attenborough could produce his documentaries without ‘travelling out of the country’.

The whole point is to bring the wider world and it’s problems to our attention.

I agree with Anja. It is about the best way to raise the most money to help the most people, simple. The past is gone, it is about the here and now, not about politics or anything else.

DL should listen to South Pacific - You've got to be carefully taught. He is British and is being racist to another Brit. Would he say the same about the London.Mayor who is also not from Africa? What has the colour of a person's skin to do with helping charity?

Also re your good point sunseeker about the cost of flying and accommodation, and using people on the ground; they often do this but there is the cost of the camera crew, technicians, etc. who are needed to film anyway and need flights and accommodation. They incur costs too so it’s just the cost of an extra sleb who will attract more in funding.

Some seem to know no one in the world of celebrity is capable of caring for others, they are all self seekers, any thing they say or do to show they care is rubbish.

Annie, I do know a celeb who never courts attention and does good by stealth. Why they get pilloried when the don't seek publicity and when they do get publicity is beyond me. Can we not accept that slebs are just like the rest of us?

Because Nonnie many of them are guilty of being wealthy

So many defensive posts here! All DL was saying, albeit clumsily, was that he thought it was time to rethink how we present the image of Africa.
He did not say we should stop charitable giving or not be compassionate. Just think about what it might be like as a person/ family/ country in receipt of aid. Many people in UK hate to rely on charity though many do & would not be happy to be on national television being seen to be ' done to'.
I have not watched Comic Relief so not sure if there are celebs posing with individual UK recipients of aid in the same way.
If a white politician had raised this I wonder how many folk would have felt so annoyed?

Bob Geldof, Diana and the black baby ,are from many years ago. Things have moved on, life has changed. We live in times dominated by visual images and having everything we desire at the click of a button ( When was the last time you used a dictionary for example or a reference book?)

I feel the image was unfortunate and David Lammy was right to comment. We should be working in conjunction with local experts, they should be the stars of the show.

Comments like " playing the race card" and " he's got a chip on his shoulder" belong in another era.

It is a tv show to raise money, people watch because of the celebrities , they do not want to sit for hours listening to ‘local experts’. Local experts belong in documentaries not in
Comic Relief, note ‘Comic’

Lily65 You are right.. too many comments suggesting racist attitudes one would hope had been consigned to the past.
Still many white people who do not want a black person to tell them they may be doing something wrong.

Annie it would be very possible to have a sponsored TV event when celebs do things in UK once a certain amount has been raised.

Do not need to have the shots of celebs " in the field" could just have short clips of the impact of previous monies raised presented by local people.

It would be possible for the format to evolve .

I assume there are comics in the countries visited by Comic Relief?

Sir Lenny Henry does indeed come from Dudley, Nonnie, as you can tell from his accent (although probably toned down these days).

I would like to hear his views on this as a co-founder of Comic Relief.

Actually I used a dictionary yesterday.

Lily you know comedians from the countries where the money raised by Comic Relief goes? , I only know of the comedians in the UK

My dictionary sits on my dining table all the time
use it often, but then I like books, all books, but have
been known to prop iPad on it

Eloethan

"I do wonder if the tone of the debate would be different if a white person had raised this matter. "
----

My tone would be no different and I would make the same point as I did yesterday.:-

" I do think the majority of people have ' moved on ' from the days of Colonialism , they have emerged in 2019 to live in a society that means we live, work, marry raise mixed families and to put it bluntly are frustrated by those who use colour to try and cause division, especially when the subject is over giving money to help other peoples lives irrespective of whether they are black, white or another.

Those who see a white person holding a black child as a 'White Benefactor ' a ' White Saviour ' are creating an issue with the pure intention of being controversial."

Eloethan

In fact I will ask you the other part of my post of yesterday as you have posted a question.

POGS Fri 01-Mar-19 16:14:36

Let's reverse ' the picture'.

It's not white Stacey Dooley holding a black child, bearing in mind African children are naturally black, for arguments sake it's Lenny Henry holding a white child because a country that is predominantly white has experienced a disaster and the UK are holding a charity fund raiser.

I don't think for one ruddy minute anybody would mention the colour of Lenny Henrys skin.

I don't think for one ruddy minute ' the majority ' of people look for the colour of skin to make a point .

Do you think it matters what colour skin either the person complaining , or the person holding a child , or indeed the child for that matter .?

It is the periphery, the under lying tone of the questioner , the perception of what lies behind the complaint that will inevitably receive attention .

i h<ve such mixed feelings on this issue- and totally get what Lammy is saying. I've always felt uncomfortable with the 'voyeuristic colonialist' aspects of Live Aid and Comic Relief. And yet, tons of money are rasied for brilliant causes- so ...

Most of the problems and poverty in Africa were caused by colonialism and our greed- and still are ... and this should be addressed properly - raising lots of money once a year just does not do the issues justice.

Good posts POGS

This debate could go on for days but it seems the damage is already done. I've been looking at twitter this morning and many are withdrawing their donations to Africa and using hashtag 'ungrateful'.

I gave my point of view yesterday.

I would also hazard a guess any white celebrity with half a brain cell will seriously consider whether to give up their free time in the future to help. Careers can be ruined.

This saddens me as I believe we've raised a generation who are far more compassionate than previous ones. The greed of the eighties replaced with a generation who on the whole (yes I know there are the live off the state scumbags) care about the planet, diversity and helping others. Someone mentioned the pointlessness of sending a team of school kids out to Africa to paint a school thereby putting locals out of work. That isn't the point. The point is to teach those kids to help others. In the hope they'll go back to the UK and carry on that ethos.

One of my sons is in the entertainment business. Only just started out but doing well. Already been on the Beeb, at the National and Royal Exchange theatres and could be forgiven at his young age to just whoop it up and revel in the glory. One of the first things he did (and he's done a few now) was to get involved in a charity project (a small one encouraging unemployed youngsters to build gardens/grow vegetables using cast off plants). He got no kudos whatsoever from such a thing. He did it because he believed in the cause and he wanted to give up his free time to help. He could've gone shopping.

I've said it before and I'll say it again, racism won't be beaten until the resentment of the past is forgotten and people stop noticing what colour people are. Unhelpful comments from racists like D.L. sets that way back as white people get offended and those who are not racist start to feel racist because they feel they are being attacked or blamed for what their ancestors did many moons ago.

Lily65 started this thread. I've seen comments she has made before that have inflamed me. Stupid comments like 'Plantation shutters are racist' when some grans were talking about getting them for their home. I eat sugar. Sugar used to be grown on plantations. Does that make me a racist because of it's association with the slave trade from way back when?

I don't believe I am a racist and I'd like to see a world where we can all live together happily but maybe this can never happen. When you have organisations like 'The Black Awards' but god forbid you create 'The White Awards' what does this achieve? Resentment. That's what. It furthers the divide and makes white people think that blacks do not want equality, they want revenge and payback. There is oversensitivity and ridiculous situations where innocent actions are branded racist.

It does not help. It creates more tension.

If I saw a black man being attacked in the street by a group of whites I would be the first to scream in disgust as such a terrible thing to do to a person. THAT is racist. A white woman holding a black child in an attempt to raise awareness that some areas of Africa still need our help should never have been turned into such an inflammatory argument and D.L. is the one who has tried to use this for his own advantage here. Not Stacey Dooley who has raised awareness on a lot of issues and should not be shot down for this.

Do you cry when you see the absolute poverty and starvation brought to our attention by white/black celebs, or whoever? I do.
Does your heart lift when you are shown girls in school and healthier children as a result of us being made aware of their plight by a black or white celeb. (I couldn't care less who they are) and donated a small amount? I am.
I am sick of people who use colour to promote their own agenda, especially when they have enjoyed all the privileges that those highlighted in these mini documentaries probably never will.
Those who criticise the fundraising and the celebs who do the short films should walk in the shoes of those they are asking us to help and then they have earned the right to get on their peverse high horses and crtiticise. Those who want black only fundraising targetted where they want, good on you, get on with it!