another transgender surprise.

To SueDonim - there is a case for anonymising a criminal record by removing gender-specific identifiers, in order to protect the individual, if that person has changed gender and is not 'out' to their employer. This is not expunging the record, just rendering it gender neutral.

One might attempt to deny criminal responsibility having changed gender, however it would not stand up in court.

"Everyone is asked to do it whether trans or cis" I don't wish to pick an argument but can we refrain from using that spurious term "cis" it's nonsensical, most women/girls won't have heard of it. I don't see why we females, over 50% of the population, have to redefine ourselves, surely women and transwomen is enough of a distinction.

Thanks for that Terri that word brings down the red mist - I regard it as hate speech against women I really do

notagran good for you to express your views. Which I tend to agree with.
Though my reason is slightly different. I fear the gradual legal encroachment into freedom of speech.
Shades of 'Big Brother'.
There's a good article about this in the Guardian today by George Monbiot. Can't find the link.

I can't for the life of me imagine what cis means and no, I haven't Googled it as I don't something like that in my search history.

It's political correctness gone raving mad!

www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/apr/10/neoliberalism-freedom-control-privatisation-state

Thanks for your views TerriBull and Maryeliza54.

You both obviously are familiar with the term and what it means, but for those who are not, the word 'cis' comes from Latin and simply means 'on the side of' as opposed to 'trans' meaning 'on the other side'. It is just another way of saying that one's current gender is the same as at birth.

As for women and girls not being familiar with the term, well when I was at school, descriptors such as 'cis' 'binary' 'non-binary' 'intersex' 'neutrois' etc were unheard of. But this is the great thing about our language and vocabulary - it is ever expanding. And today we find ourselves with so many choices in how we would like to be identified as, should we so choose.

SalsaQueen - I don't see it as political correctness at all. In situations where one might want to use a gender descriptor for oneself, it is far better than saying 'normal' 'natural' or 'biological' female or male.

Each to his or her own however

The issue Granny is that I’m
Gender critical - I had a sex at birth not a gender. Gender is a social construct

SueDonim
MN and GN will have your email address, your IP address and, if you have entered any competitions, your postal address. Presumably these are held on record.

notanan I didn't see any of your deleted posts, only those left on here I think it is vitally important that people understand the implications of this and other cases

As far as I am concerned the implications are far is our data protected and whether or not we should be able to have complete freedom of speech within the constraints of the law.
Who decides what is hateful? A person who has been hurt or a judge?
Is that what you meant?

Good call there maryeliza54 - a better explanation would have been that cis denotes a person whose current gender identity matches the sex assigned to them at birth.

On a side note, I googled 'gender critical' because I wasn't sure if you had coined the phrase as a wry comment, or whether it was actually a 'thing'. It led me to a sub reddit that looks really interesting, so thanks for that (whether intended or not!)

Goodness yes, ' cis-woman' makes me see red, too, as does the Green Party's 'men and non-men'. It's pure mysogyny, an attempt to erase all those pesky women.

Thanks for being open to discussion Granny but no I can’t accept that definition either as I’m gender critical. I am a woman, adult human female.

Yes, I'm aware of that, Callistemon. In this particular case, as I understand it, the poster used a 'burner' email address and only made three posts so it's unlikely MN has any more info on them.

SueDonim - The Green's are not on my political radar so I wan't aware of that. I suppose it is accurate, in a 1984 newspeak manner, but it is ridiculous!

maryeliza54 - forgive me if I am failing to understand here, but by being gender critical you don't have any inner concept of being feminine/masculine? That sounds very liberating.

What the flip is "gender critical" when it's at home?

Ah well - I was brought up in a world that was not gender critical so I was subject to many of the stereotypical manifestations of masculinity and femininity which I’ve had to try to address.

And what's a "burner" email address?

Bring critical of the concept of gender of course.

Yes I second that maryeliza, using the word only gives credence to a term that is wholly superfluous and diminishes us. I do believe that the onus should be on the infinitesimal minority to redefine themselves rather than the overwhelming majority where nothing will have changed as far as what sex we are since birth.

Whilst I appreciate language is evolving all the time, my perception is that most women will have never have come across such a word. A friend of mine who was asked to complete some sort of questionnaire at her place of work, was given multiple choices of how she wished to describe herself, "cis" being one of them, she wrote "no idea what a cis woman is so couldn't say one way or the other." That I imagine would be the response of the wider population. Those women who are familiar with the term, through sites like MN, I think you will find can't stand it.

Julia Hartley-Brewer told a man on air, that she would ask him to leave her studio when he used it. It might be a tiny word but adopting it has massive ramifications. We should collectively resist accepting it's use.

This is a good starting pint

real-feminist-history.com/2016/12/25/gender-critical-feminism/

I didn't really know what 'cis' meant although I have heard the term used, so I looked it up. It did sound vaguely familiar the first time I heard it and, of course, it is a Latin term meaning 'this side of' eg Cisalpine Gaul (part of the Roman Empire on this side of the Alps).

Cis and Trans were originally only used for definition of locations of geographical areas.
Are we still allowed to use them for that purpose?

I am a woman. Born a female and grew into womanhood.
One thing I hate to hear is a mixed group of people being called 'guys.
'Hi guys' is heard in pubs cafes and restaurants the world over.
I am not one.
On one occasion I was treated to a pub meal with some family members when we 'guys' were asked for our order.
With great restraint I kept schtum but had a word with the manager privately on the way out.
It's probably under the heading 'equality'.
Be anyone anywhere, anytime.
Fly to Oz as a man and return as woman, not having had any surgery or medication.
I think my next move will be in a barn as a cow, not just any cow, a Jersey cow.