Gransnet forums

News & politics

How bad could things get after six more years?

(80 Posts)
winterwhite Thu 30-May-19 09:58:31

Yesterday's morning papers carried reviews of a book on how to make proper meals out of tinned food from food banks, an article about long waits for GP appointments and another about the difficulty claimants have in contacting benefits agencies. Then on the 10 p.m news we saw heart-breaking examples of the state to which people are reduced because of cuts in social care funding, juxtaposed with a report on starvation and shortages of food and medicine in Venezuela after 6 years of bad government.
Just six years! 'We used not to live like this', said one elderly woman crouched over a candle. What could happen here if we have 6 more years of going downhill? 2025. A further 24 years apparently before we start seeing the benefits of Brexit.... Yet the problems of poverty, lack of housing and the care crisis have nothing to do with the EU. Jeremy Corbyn may be wrong about many things but he is right about that. How I hope that the Tory and Lib Dem leadership contenders concentrate first on how, and how quickly, they would tackle crises at home.

Callistemon Thu 30-May-19 12:50:56

Anyone watch Panarama
does that deserve a thread Whitewave?

I think the lines are blurred between NHS continuing care and social care and we do need to pay more tax to enable Government funding to be provided for decent services rather than leaving the LAs to try to cope as best they can.

winterwhite Thu 30-May-19 12:52:53

An interesting variety of posts. Yes, I do think things are bad now for millions of people whose voices are never listened too, and I see little prospect of things getting better - esp if we have a new tory prime minister promising tax cuts, and I don't think it's 'moaning' to say so.

Margaux Thu 30-May-19 13:00:25

Hi Grany,

Can you please tell me of any official stuff explaining how the NHS is being sold? Last I heard expenditure on the NHS is the highest it's ever been.

Margaux Thu 30-May-19 13:03:30

Grany, I sent you a query that somehow got on the next page - sorry.

crazyH Thu 30-May-19 13:06:13

Yes I watched depressing.

Margaux Thu 30-May-19 13:50:29

Winterwhite, I certainly don't think it's 'moaning' if you are saying we should be paying more taxes. But if some people already feel the squeeze, it will mean more, not less, squeeze.

NanaSuzy Thu 30-May-19 13:50:52

I know there are people who are struggling. But I went to a large retail complex yesterday. It was absolutely rammed. And the cafes/restaurants/sandwich shops - queues outside each and every one. Yes it's half-term and some people may have been there with the kids as a treat out of the ordinary but they were spending like the clappers.

PamGeo Thu 30-May-19 13:51:11

Living in Cornwall and coming from the industrial North East I can see the vast difference in rural and urban poverty.
The poverty is different and it isn't just the North / South divide, but it's still poverty.

I can see the difference in the families that come on holiday, the many many wealthy people who have a second home or even a few that have more, as they have bought a little getaway surfing pod for their teenagers. The families who have probably saved up for months for their family getaway in caravans and tents who pray it's a flipflop kinda day and not the wellies.

Wealth and success often go hand in hand with privilege, those from a privileged background get the benefits from the moment they are conceived. There are those who can and will succeed in life but they are often the exceptions rather than the rule, luck plays a huge part as much as hard work.

Education, Health, Hope and Opportunity is what every politician should be trying their best to provide for the population and then, we can improve things for ourselves. Without these basic needs being met we haven't a cat in hells chance of ever changing anything no matter who is in No: 10's throne of swords

Labaik Thu 30-May-19 14:04:44

And we must remember that schools and hospitals are still under terrible pressure financially; I assume teachers are still leaving the profession in droves [DD left teaching last year even though she loved it; the pressure just got too great].

Labaik Thu 30-May-19 14:05:58

..a friend of mine who lives in Yorkshire has always stressed the point that rural poverty is as bad as urban poverty...

PamGeo Thu 30-May-19 14:36:56

Poverty is debilitating regardless of where you live or the causes Labaik, it gets right to the heart and soul of a person and community.

Labaik Thu 30-May-19 14:54:41

I thought after I'd written it that 'bad' wasn't the word I meant to use...I should have used 'prevalent' or something similar. My friend just used to stress that people always thing of poverty as being something that only happened in towns and cities; she does a lot of work with CAB in her rural area.

Grany Thu 30-May-19 15:04:44

Hi Margaux

This video An evening with Dr Bob Gill will explain everything. He made a film The Great NHS Heist through crowdfunding

sarahellenwhitney Thu 30-May-19 16:15:01

Try a visit to Cornwall on a Bank holiday and I'll show you cars and people on holiday.

Labaik Thu 30-May-19 16:18:18

Well, those are the people that can still afford it. Why does that show that lots of other people who aren't there can afford it also?

crystaltipps Thu 30-May-19 16:45:13

I didn’t say no one had a car or went on holiday - but have you seen the figures for new car buying? The industry is in the doldrums- people just hanging onto their old cars, also any estate agent will tell you how hard it is to sell in some areas, plus prices have fallen. Travel. Companies also tell of a difficult time and how they have cut prices. This may be a good thing in many ways, but not if you work in those industries or are trying to sell your house.

rosecarmel Thu 30-May-19 17:21:31

Please provide proof that the US is more divided than the UK-

Currently, both are experiencing similar to different degrees in similar areas-

Prosperity takes up more real estate than necessary- It drives a higher number of resident families out of their smaller spaces and storefronts to make room for the few with the finances to afford the new rents and rates, including the ever increasing number of tourists perpetually spinning through its turnstiles-

The process of prosperity drives some people into impoverished conditions and others into plentiful-

Those pushed out by the wave of wealth experience psychological and financial hardship- As a result they enter into the maze of the social service qualifying process which is designed only for the brave to navigate and the faint of heart to fall by the wayside-

Keep in mind that landlords can legally use credit scores and background checks to accept or refuse who to rent to-

Those that strive, and eventually qualify, settle into their impoverished lairs to eat pizza and smoke pot after the nerve wracking procedure-

As Americans become accustomed to maneuvering disparity and scarcity, many are choosing to live together under the same roof-

MaizieD Thu 30-May-19 17:57:13

Well, those are the people that can still afford it. Why does that show that lots of other people who aren't there can afford it also?

My thoughts too, Labaik

The fact that people can do this is not evidence that everyone can. It's a really strange argument.

Bingo card is getting filled, I'm afraid.

MaizieD Thu 30-May-19 18:01:32

Anyhow, on the positive side - there are more people employed here than in many other countries on the continent of Europe.

As people who work one hour a week are counted as 'employed' in the employment figures I don't think that this is a particularly reliable indicator of the absence of poverty.

Do some people find the idea of their fellow citizens living in poverty so dreadful that they prefer to close their eyes and minds completely to the idea?

varian Thu 30-May-19 18:57:38

In the 1980s the Royal Statistical Society, a very well respected learned body founded in 1834, for the first time in its existence, spoke out against a government when Margaret Thatcher redefined unemployment for the 19th time.

Surely an honest definition of employment would be "employed for as many hours as it takes to earn a living wage"?

I have no idea where the UK would stand in international league tables by that measure but I suspect we would be pretty low down the order of decent, democratic, developed, countries.

pinkquartz Thu 30-May-19 23:52:23

It is not a case of being moaner if you need social care to stay alive and you can't get it due to budget cuts.

Not all of us are living an easy life.
Rural poverty can be harder than urban because of things like almost no public transport.
There are no resources to get help from.

Most deprivation is being hidden.
That many can afford holidays might be true but how do you know it's not all paid for by credit card?

bruff Fri 31-May-19 08:23:49

Goodness me I read some of these posts and picture the person writing seating in there mortgage free house, scrolling through the latest holiday book for there next cruise. I’m alright jack comes to Mind. I watched the panorama bbc1 programme on social care and felt so angry. Sure there are scrounges using the system we all see that every day, but it’s the genuine people in distress that are not getting the help that they desperately need. As for tax, if Amazon and the rest paid tax, and we reduced the amount of foreign aid we send
To countries where we never sure it gets to where it should we would have the money, which we have anyway to look after those who genuinely need help. As for politics, and Brexit
I voted to join the common Market, no one at the that time told me the minute we left we couldn’t afford a lamb joint or butter would be of the shopping list, because we would have to start paying subsidies to other countries. And that there would end a block of 28. We have been on our own for thousands of years. We.ll be fine when we & if we ever leave. Also let’s have a General Election Get a labour government in. Ask the DUP for the Billion pounds back the Tory’s paid them to stay in government, that should help out a bit with care. Right that’s me done Happy Fridays everyone

Grany Fri 31-May-19 08:32:32

I agree with you. Collect the taxes from the les of Amazon etc Then vote Labour for a fairer society

Grany Fri 31-May-19 08:36:42


Thus is what the government are doing.

sarahellenwhitney Fri 31-May-19 09:33:27

New cars can have teething problems maybe still under guarantee but never the less can be inconvenient and considering new shouldn't have happened plus the moment they leave the show room drop in value. On two occasions have I bought new and vowed never again.