Has Anyone Changed Their Mind?

It is absolutely clear that Johnson has not got a clue, and would throw us all in an impossible, and dire situation. Again Rory Stewart seems to understand this:

www.facebook.com/Channel4News/videos/467463947154190/

The CEO from Iceland was brilliant on QT last night. He voted to Leave, but has now changed his mind and thinks the only way out of this is a Referendum on the current situation.

But then there was Caroline Flint, who said she voted to remain but thinks the only democratic thing to do is to honour the referendum result and leave.

That's my position too. I voted to remain, but don't want another vote. No amount of claims and suppositions that people didn't know what they were voting for, that more leave voters have died recently than remain voters (!), that the young people who couldn't be bothered to vote would all have voted remain, can alter the fact that we were told before the referendum that this was a binding vote, and we remainers lost.

If we decide we need another referendum because certain participants lied during the campaign, we'll have to re-run every single election we ever have. Because, let's be honest, do any of us really believe that candidates tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth? We factor in the embellishments and half-truths before we make our decisions.

And I'm sorry, JackyB, but I think it only fair that people who were obviously settled in other countries did not get to vote. When we had the Common Market vote back in 1975, I wasn't allowed to vote because I'd lived in Germany for just a couple of months, even though I planned to return after a year. I still think that was unfair, but surely it's different if you've lived elsewhere for 40 years?

Well crystaltipps “The “good news about Brexit” trumpets seem to have withered now though,“ - we Leavers can’t win on here! A few months ago I started a thread which ran to 1,000 posts - good news about Brexit.

It was upbeat, cheerful and optimistic. And polite. Encouraging others to share any good news they’d heard about Brexit.

But even the ✅ I put at the end of the title thread got me shot down!

I kept a lower profile for a while specifically because my sunny disposition about it all seemed to rile up the Remain voters.

As I say, we can’t win!
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I've always been "can't decide". As a pisces I can see both sides.

That's no bad thing, Fennel, imho. The world needs more people who can see the other point of view.

Tricky though Fennel when you walk into a polling station eh?
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I don’t know anyone in RL who talks about Brexit, but in my immediate family no one has changed their mind.

I seem to recall that most of the posts on the good news about Brexit were not actually living up to the title and mostly about things people had bought in the shops and holidays they were going on that were nothing to do with Brexit at all. Anyone pointing that out decried as moaners or not believing enough.

I can only speak for my own posts on that thread.
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Most of the people I know voted Remain and would vote Remain again. I also know of a few Leave voters who would now go for Remain.

I certainly haven't change my mind.

It was only 37% of those eligible to vote three years ago who wanted to leave so whatever 'deal' was devised wouldn't please many.

I think that the situation has got a whole lot worse since then. We can't go back and pretend it never happened and the way ahead looks bleak.

I assume that everybody would like to see the end but why do people assume that those Remainers who want to get it over and done with now want to leave? I want it finished but I want the revocation of Article 50. I can't imagine why they should change their minds. Nothing that's been said by politicians or the media has made me want to leave. If anything, it's the reverse.

Just about everyone I know well voted Remain. Nobody’s changed their mind on that. The only one in the family who voted Leave (son’s mother in law) has changed and would now vote Remain.

I voted leave and would vote leave again.
I wouldn’t mind another referendum but if the result were remain - I’d want another referendum -keep re-running the race until we get the result we want - that sounds democratic, hmmm and vaguely familiar...

Someone upthread said they were a Leaver but wished that Cameron had never called the referendum. Let's not forget that it still doesn't have to happen - we could rescind Article 50 and stay as we are, at least while we take stock of the situation and our likely options. If a future government wished to do so, they could reconsider the whole issue, but any referendum would need to be on an agreed exit strategy that was acceptable to our Parliament and to the EU, not on a vague promise of a dream deal that simply doesn't exist.

Very few of us have changed our minds. I voted REMAIN and still feel that way and cannot understand why anyone would vote LEAVE. There were around 44,000,000 voters in 2016 of whom 33,000,000 voted. Of the 44,000,000 roughly 2,000,000 have passed away and about the same number of younger voters have become eligible. Since 2016 we have learnt a lot more so the demographic has changed. A no-deal Brexit will seriously harm manufacturing and agriculture. True there are areas which may not be impacted but none to my knowledge which would be better off with us leaving. The Irish Border issue has yet to be resolved, there will probably another vote on Scottish Independence. The only fair way is to have another referendum with the fact properly set out and a choice of REMAIN or go with deal/no-deal negotiated, Fracturing the EU risks conflict in Europe and no one wants that.

Messrs Farage and Johnson told many lies and if those lies influenced just a few voters then result is unreliable. Russian interference was highly likely. If then people still want out then we will just have to get on with it.

“If then people still want out then we will just have to get on with it.”

That’d be a nice change.
After 3 long years of trying to block it.
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All of the leavers I know are still leave
All of the remainers I know are still remain.

I was always on the fense, tipping ever so slightly towards remain, and am still remain but still not fiercly pre everything about the EU

I don't suppose anybody is pro everything about the EU.

From what I've read since the referendum the EU was starting to look in at itself and recognise that changes were needed.

In fact the EU had started to look at the taxation of the international corporations, unlike our own dear government that has let many off paying the right amount of tax. An EU commission reported in April this year that the UK has granted unjustified exemption from UK anti tax avoidance rules. Instead of going after the "big boys"

HMRC is targeting relatively low earning individuals. They are currently dealing with agency workers - nurses, social workers etc etc who operate through companies. These people have been 'forced' to use agencies who claim, erroneously that about half of their earnings are 'loans' of 'dividends' or 'business pay' . You could argue that they should have known better and that they were part of a tax avoidance scheme but nevertheless, there have been one or two suicides and many more who are feeling suicidal because they can't pay the tax which they have been told is due.

Lastly, Big Pharma is currently lobbying the EU because the European Commission which is reviewing the system of incentives and rewards for the large pharmaceutical companies.