Westminster peaodophile ring, Nick, guilty of perverting course of justice and fraud

As for Tom Watson, he should be thoroughly ashamed of himself.

As a society we still have much to do to safeguard our children and young people. On a regular basis, information comes out of the IISSA which demonstrates how badly we have failed and are still failing so many vulnerable children and young people. Better systems will serve everyone - abused children and those accused falsely.

Ensuring

Who’s dismissing the accused innocent lives ruined annie? Sadly nothing can change the last, we can only do our best to lessen the chances of this happening again. I’ve said several times what has to change.
a) a neutral attitude by the police when a complaint is made to them
b) a complete black out on names being released - this should apply to the media as well as the police obviously
c) thorough and robust investigations to test the information given
d) a review of the CPS and its decision making re charging
e) a review of disclosure processes

Enduring it’s less likely to happen again will be the best thing that can be done now. People like Beech are really rare - I can’t remember another case of this magnitude involving such high profile figures- can anyone e,se?

The worst thing that could come out of this would be to deter future victims from coming forward by swinging the pendulum so far that all complainants are treated like Beech.

We cannot dismiss those accused yet innocent, lives ruined.

suziewoozie

"The Beech case tells us about the failings of the investigatory process which were legion and about naming before charging but not much else."
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Not much else!

It tells us that some people will wilfully damage the lives of others.

It tells us some people will wilfully lie, cheat and propagate utter rubbish to score political points.

It tells us how people wilfully believe they can be as abusive, create an atmosphere of institutional wrong doing without one drop of evidence.

It tells us ' some ' police officers were totally so personally involved in accusations they did not perform their duties as a police officer.

It tells us Parliamentary Privilege can be used a tool/weapon to make false allegations and statements without redress.

I could go on.

Whether it be the likes of Christopher Jefferies, Politicians, indeed anybody there lives are destroyed by the Kangaroo Court Waller's who feast on believing the likes of Tom Watson et all. they deserve better.

How many stories of students that have been cleared of wrong doing , rape etc. have we read. If that were your son, husband, grandson would you still think ' not much else ' .

I understand all the periphery points such as victims coming forward, victims being put off etc. but this case had huge ramifications for those poor souls caught up in what to my mind was some sort of cabal of players who knew exactly what their lies were leading up to.

The fact Carl Beech was assisted by 'some' who hold positions of office / trust should not be dismissed as ' not much else ' in my book.

Accusers should be scrutinised before any names are mentioned as many accusers have an axe to grind, or are like this monster---just pure evil.

It's damn scary when the police can't tell the difference between lies and the truth !!

I’d need to see the data behind the news story that annie heard on the news before I could comment. I’d start with definitions first of all. We also know that many cases are not reported but covered by those in positions of power . The Beech case tells us about the failings of the investigatory process which were legion and about naming before charging but not much else.

No they didn't but that is still no reason to take from that the assumption that 2 out of 3 claims are false.

The police didn’t have trouble investigating the victims of
Carl Beech

The fact that two out of three accusations of abuse do not result in anyone being found guilty by a court, does not, however, mean that the other two accusations were not true or were malicious. Historical accusations in particular are very difficult to investigate, and even harder to prove.
Just because this Carl Beech person made things up, we should not automatically go on to think or assert that therefore two out of three accusations are false.

Reported on the new today

Of all accusations of child abuse , 1/3 are found guilty,

2/3 of cases dropped or not guilty verdict

Carl Beech, 51, from Gloucester, was sentenced for 12 counts of perverting the course of justice, one of fraud, and for several child sexual offences.
--

Several Sex Offences.

Couldn't make it up.

Carl Beech has been jailed for 18 years.

His lies and fantasies were found out but what if they had not?

The shocking way Labour Deputy Leader Tom Watson, EXARO, some media and commentators on and off Social Media, ' some' police officers chose to believe this fantasist was quite shocking to witness.

The abuse and pure and simple bile his victims suffered was compounded by the fact the public engaged in the personal trashing of their characters too, usually for political point scoring.

I hope now the likes of Harvey Proctor have the strength at such an age to challenge those who initiated, possibly encouraged Carl Beech, to make his lies seem credible and it should start with the ease of Parliamentarians to hide behind Parliamentary Privilege.

I hope too those who did not die whilst this shameful pursuit carried on sue for defamation of character and of their loved ones. The main players engaging in the initial ' Guilty until proven Innocent' who categorically stated they were guilty and had hard evidence should not get away with it.

That accused's body language spoke volumes to me so why didn't the police twig ? I'd have had no hesitation in blaming the fantasist as they all seem to have the same air about them.

I had experience of one the other week yet I didn't know him from Adam but knew that all wasn't as it should be and I was proved right.The case goes on. They're evil !

I’ve heard and read a lot of ( rightful) condemnation over the last 24 hours. What the issue is that almost certainly no one will be held accountable for the many failings.

But Jennifer what is a ‘case like this’? It’s only through investigation that the facts should be established. The issue with this case appears to be that there was an over eager propensity to believe him in the context of post-Savile and a totally inadequate ( to say the least) investigation. And the men abused the football coach were not young when they eventually came forward. I think your argument for naming the accusers just does not make sense.

I did say in cases like this. I didn’t believe for one moment that he was telling the truth and am amazed as everyone that the Met didn’t discover immediately what type of character they were dealing with. Obviously it is a different situation with a young person. Thank goodness the Northumbrian police were on the ball

It also says a lot to me when the facts are known and proven to be a load of lies, propaganda and fantasy how little condemnation is shown as opposed to the condemnation which surfaced when the story was believed.

Shameful.

Thank you Anniebach

Well said POGS,

I agree with suziewoozie naming accusers would deter many from coming forward. I do think those accused should not be named until charged

Jennifer I couldn’t agree less - do you honestly think a 19 year old girl, for example, having suffered years of sexual abuse and finally daring to go to the police should be named? Do you think those grown men who came forward about the football coach should have been named from the onset? The real problem is naming the accused before charging ( which the police aren’t supposed to do anyway), poor quality investigation, problems with disclosure and poor CPS decision making. Cliff Richards problems were caused entirely by the police and the BBC as tge damages he’s been awarded demonstrate. Your suggestion would weed out a lot of victims and enable a lot of abusers to carry on unpunished ( as the majority do anyway).

Yes ' certain ' Police Officers should be held accountable and questions asked now the facts and truth are known. I am not of the opinion and most certainly not saying they were wrong to initiate investigations but the behaviour and professional standard was lacking by certain officers at times.

I think facts should be established as to why ' certain ' Police Officers followed the thoughts of those who were behind / promoting the fantasies and lies of Carl Beech as I feel there was possibly a game at foot and good policing came second. More than happy to be proven wrong but the interview outside Ted Heaths home, Arundells, by Mike Veale, Wiltshire Police’s chief constable and his accusations never sat right with me as one example.

It is a fact however Labour Deputy Leader Tom Watson and the now defunct website ' EXARO ' were at the forefront of promoting the fantasies and lies of Carl Beech. I said from the start, even on Gransnet threads, I want to know ' if ' or what extent their involvement has coloured the Police investigation ' Operation Midland ' for one example.

I remember distinctly the posts that followed the kangaroo court phenomena in trusting what Tom Watson said and applauded his use of Parliamentary Privilege and personal comments.

Likewise those in the media whether it be on TV, radio, papers or social media who believed and tried to make the accusations stick, give credence to the fantasies and lies should apologise too.

What will of course happen is denial/not me guv/pretence they never spoke a nasty word. They forget the articles they wrote, the interviews they did, their speeches in Parliament, what they wrote on social media which are probably still there to show how disengenuous they are.